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  1. #1
    pimpdaddy1787's Avatar
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    Question 04 msx 150 boost drops and ski dies

    hello everyone. i am new to this site but have read and found some great things. i have some problems that i need help with.
    first off i am a gm technician and have worked on/around boats and pwc for a while so testing and fixing isnt a problem as long as someone can lead me in a good direction.
    my friend has 2 identicle '04 msx 150's and now one of them idles good. then you punch it and the boost comes to full bars and ski starts to get on plane then boost gauge drops 3 bars and you come to idle again. the check eng. lite comes on. if you turn ski off for 5 minutes then try again you get the same result. if you slowly apply throttle will run good up to 55mph or so. thats were both skis top out.
    he took them to a guys house who was "polaris certified" so he says and looks as though he replaced wastegate solenoid. but didnt use factory one. jerry rigged another in place.
    is there a way i can read codes, where should i start to look and how should i component test things? any help greatly appreciated.
    Last edited by pimpdaddy1787; 08-24-2009 at 08:49 PM. Reason: title change


  2. #2
    casey67's Avatar
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    Welcome to Green Hulk

    Yes ,you can get codes with out the soft ware. It is sinmilar to the old GM's ,where you jump a couple wires and the light flashes. K447 wrote up a great articule of how it's done and code deffinetions. I'm pretty sure it is in the tech/info section.
    Try to search for it,otherwise someone will chime in.

    PS,the 4 stroke is a little different than most of us have experience with,there are several members that have alot of experience with the 4 stroke,you might need to wait for them to reply.

  3. #3
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by casey67 View Post
    ...K447 wrote up a great articule of how it's done and code definitions...

    PS,the 4 stroke is a little different than most of us have experience with,there are several members that have alot of experience with the 4 stroke,you might need to wait for them to reply.
    Welcome

    That code reading LED method is for the 2-stroke Ficht fuel injected engines, not the Weber turbo 4-stroke engines.

    There are a few Weber engine experts around, but they don't pop in every day...

    This link may be useful;
    Polaris MSX 150, MSX 110
    with Weber 4-stroke engines

  4. #4
    casey67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K447 View Post
    Welcome

    That code reading LED method is for the 2-stroke Ficht fuel injected engines, not the Weber turbo 4-stroke engines.

    There are a few Weber engine experts around, but they don't pop in every day...

    This link may be useful;
    Polaris MSX 150, MSX 110
    with Weber 4-stroke engines
    Oooops.
    He said 150 not 140
    As always ,K is spot on.

    When is the 4 stroke diag going to be explained ?

  5. #5
    desperado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpdaddy1787 View Post
    hello everyone. i am new to this site but have read and found some great things. i have some problems that i need help with.
    first off i am a gm technician and have worked on/around boats and pwc for a while so testing and fixing isnt a problem as long as someone can lead me in a good direction.
    my friend has 2 identicle '04 msx 150's and now one of them idles good. then you punch it and the boost comes to full bars and ski starts to get on plane then boost gauge drops 3 bars and you come to idle again. the check eng. lite comes on. if you turn ski off for 5 minutes then try again you get the same result. if you slowly apply throttle will run good up to 55mph or so. thats were both skis top out.
    he took them to a guys house who was "polaris certified" so he says and looks as though he replaced wastegate solenoid. but didnt use factory one. jerry rigged another in place.
    is there a way i can read codes, where should i start to look and how should i component test things? any help greatly appreciated.
    I would first verify the wastegate arm is moving freely on the turbocharger. A stuck or partially stuck wastegate arm will not allow rapid reaction of the wastegate and boost pressure will be erratic. This is a common problem on the MSX turbo 4 strokes. Based on the description you provide, it seems you're getting an overboost condition -- the engine goes in self-protect mode when the throttle is quickly cracked open but can reach top speed when gradual throttle is applied. An overboost code will clear by stopping and restarting the engine....... sounds like a partially stuck wastegate arm to me..... give it a good a look....

    The only way to retrieve codes on the ME7.4.4 ECU is to use Polaris Digital Wrench. Note that the ECU is OBDII compliant, but the serial communication plug is different from OBDII and the code read protocol is likely different from the automotive industry. The codes themselves are the same as in the automotive industry and can be retreived and crossed reference using standard "P" definitions......

  6. #6
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by desperado View Post
    ... The only way to retrieve codes on the ME7.4.4 ECU is to use Polaris Digital Wrench.

    Note that the ECU is OBDII compliant, but the serial communication plug is different from OBDII and the code read protocol is likely different from the automotive industry.

    The codes themselves are the same as in the automotive industry and can be retrieved and crossed reference using standard "P" definitions......
    Could you check into that for us?

    It would be interesting if we could adapt a 'standard' OBD II code reader to work on the Weber PWC

    Or if the code read protocol really is different, perhaps we could cook up a simple program/device to read them out.

  7. #7
    casey67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K447 View Post
    Could you check into that for us?

    It would be interesting if we could adapt a 'standard' OBD II code reader to work on the Weber PWC

    Or if the code read protocol really is different, perhaps we could cook up a simple program/device to read them out.
    Quote Originally Posted by desperado View Post
    I would first verify the wastegate arm is moving freely on the turbocharger. A stuck or partially stuck wastegate arm will not allow rapid reaction of the wastegate and boost pressure will be erratic. This is a common problem on the MSX turbo 4 strokes. Based on the description you provide, it seems you're getting an overboost condition -- the engine goes in self-protect mode when the throttle is quickly cracked open but can reach top speed when gradual throttle is applied. An overboost code will clear by stopping and restarting the engine....... sounds like a partially stuck wastegate arm to me..... give it a good a look....

    The only way to retrieve codes on the ME7.4.4 ECU is to use Polaris Digital Wrench. Note that the ECU is OBDII compliant, but the serial communication plug is different from OBDII and the code read protocol is likely different from the automotive industry. The codes themselves are the same as in the automotive industry and can be retreived and crossed reference using standard "P" definitions......
    On my "generic OBD II code reader" (with limited data display)
    When it powers up,it displays " linked to vehicle using J 1850 PWM protocol ".
    Does any of that make any sense ?

  8. #8

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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by pimpdaddy1787 View Post
    hello everyone. i am new to this site but have read and found some great things. i have some problems that i need help with.
    first off i am a gm technician and have worked on/around boats and pwc for a while so testing and fixing isnt a problem as long as someone can lead me in a good direction.
    my friend has 2 identicle '04 msx 150's and now one of them idles good. then you punch it and the boost comes to full bars and ski starts to get on plane then boost gauge drops 3 bars and you come to idle again. the check eng. lite comes on. if you turn ski off for 5 minutes then try again you get the same result. if you slowly apply throttle will run good up to 55mph or so. thats were both skis top out.
    he took them to a guys house who was "polaris certified" so he says and looks as though he replaced wastegate solenoid. but didnt use factory one. jerry rigged another in place.
    is there a way i can read codes, where should i start to look and how should i component test things? any help greatly appreciated.
    first off that boost gauge is nothing more that reading rpm's
    like the guys are saying check arm on the waste gate control-they freeze up often
    also if oil gets on the 2 sensor that's in the intake system-it will run poor(it's looking at differential pressure


    later cd

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