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  1. #1
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Arrow 2002 Genesis i won't start when cold or 'cool'

    With permission from wilbur1 I am posting a set of PMs we have been exchanging regarding his 2002 Genesis i.
    Minor editing for clarity

    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur1
    I have a 2002 Genesis i with 300 hours on it that I have owned from new. I have done nothing but add fuel and oil till today.

    Here's the problem and what I've tried.
    I was riding the other day and shut the machine off and it never started again without help.

    The machine won't start on it's own,
    it just wheels over but won't fire

    If I spray a little fuel in the carbs it will start immediately and keep running indefinitely to full potential.

    I can start it and stop it as much as I want as long as I don't wait more than 30 seconds between attempts.

    if I go past this time frame I need to add a little fuel to a carb or two and it starts right way and continues to run.

    I've had the fuel pump out and put the regulator back in its place.[it had fallen out].
    I've checked the fuel pressure and its around 23 pounds cranking and 27 pounds with the motor running.

    It just won't start on its own but will run forever once running.


  2. #2
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Welcome to the Hulk

    Another Canadian, eh - where are you located?

    It is OK to create a new thread for issues like this, in the Polaris General Discussions forum. That way, others can benefit from the information, long after your own machine is fixed.

    Click here for information related to the Ficht fuel injected 2-stroke models (1999-2004)

    How long ago did you repair the fuel pump regulator?

    It sounds like the 45 volt power section inside the EMM has weakened, and the EMM needs repair.

    Do you have any other Polaris fuel injected machines on hand?
    If you do, there is a test you can do using a second/spare EMM to confirm whether the EMM is actually the problem.

    While cranking, the EMM needs to boost the injector voltage on the White/Red wires up from battery voltage to over 20 volts. Once the engine actually starts, the EMM regulates the injector voltage to around 45 volts.

    If the EMM voltage booster is weak, the injectors don't get enough voltage to actually inject fuel while cranking.

    Once you prime the engine and it fires up, the higher RPM generates more electrical power, and the injectors can now function.

    Sometimes a failing TPS can cause a no-start condition. Unplug the TPS connector at the rear of the throttle body, see if it starts. If no start, re-connect the TPS.

    I suspect that if you unplugged any one fuel injector, the engine will start on its own. If it does, that is an indication of weak injector voltage.

    There are other possible causes for low injector voltage during cranking, but I would mostly suspect the EMM.

    Other possible causes include;
    Stator coils are damaged
    Flywheel magnet(s) have become loose/damaged
    Corroded or weak connections between stator and EMM, or corrosion at the EMM pins.

    At the moment, the only repair service for the Polaris EMM is;

    DFI Technologies Inc.
    Repair and update of Ficht Fuel Injection (FFI) EMM used in Polaris Direct Injection (DI) PWC engines.
    Email: [email protected]
    [email protected]
    DFI Technologies
    22638 Canal Rd
    Orange Beach, AL
    USA 36561
    1-866-298-1510
    +1 (251) 974-5210 Voice
    +1 (251) 974-5226 FAX

    Note: Call or email first before sending EMM

  3. #3
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur1
    I live just north of Sault Ste Marie Ontario right on Lake Superior.

    Although I have two Polaris four wheelers and three sleds the only Polaris PWC around is mine and although I work on Seadoos lots this is my first problem with my Polaris PWC. So unfortunately there are no machines around to swap parts with.

    However I just went outside and pulled off one injector wire and the machine started unaided and sat and idled on two cylinders.

    As soon as I plugged the injector back in it wouldn't start again.

    So I guess you have ruled out the fuel pump for me [oh yeah, I just fixed the Regulator today].

    I guess it's looking like the EMM
    Thanks a million for pointing me in the right direction although it looks like an expensive one
    Open to suggestions on my next move
    .

  4. #4
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    I am surprised that the fuel pump and the EMM failed at the same time.

    Before the fuel pump problem occurred, did you ever see a red lamp or warning messages on the MFI display?

    Is it possible you damaged, bumped, or did not fully reconnect any of the plugs, wire harness splices, or anything else related to the electrical system?

    Did the machine ever start properly after the fuel pump repair?
    What about just before the fuel pump was repaired?

    You might want to read the stored EMM service codes;
    How to read Polaris Ficht EMM trouble codes without special software or a computer

    You will have triggered a code with the injector being unplugged (51, 52, or 53), but there may be some other codes stored.

    If you do read the codes, let me know what they are. Do NOT clear the codes, just read them out.

    DFI will use a specialized computer to read more details about each stored code...

    While you are in there, take the time to check that the small cooling hoses to the engine stator cover and EMM are not kinked, and flow water freely.

    If the water flow through the EMM is blocked, the EMM will overheat, and that is one certain way to cause an EMM failure.

    If you decide to send the EMM to DFI, be sure to ask them exactly what failed, and what parts they replaced.

    There seem to be a few common failure items inside these EMM, and I am trying to gather as much info as I can.

    BTW, it is good to hear about engines with 300 hours that are still running well (EMM not withstanding).

    Have you checked cylinder compression lately?

    How often do you change spark plugs and the oil filter?

    When it is running properly, what is the peak sustained RPM?

  5. #5
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur1
    I have never checked the compression on the machine and I just changed the spark plugs for the first time last spring. They looked like new.

    And you will love this, I have never changed the oil filter.

    One of the sleds I was talking about earlier is a 1993 storm with 24,000 miles on it with only a couple of oil filter changes.

    I just had the injectors off yesterday and they too had very little carbon build up.

    The tops of the pistons look just like new.

    My daughter has been riding in front of me all summer so I wasn't paying as much attention as I used to and I'm drawing a blank on the RPM.

    Up until it quit the top speed was within a couple of MPH of when it was new measured with my on board GPS.

    The machine has been a little hard to start on the first ride of the day for quite a while now but once started in the morning it would start instantly all day long.

    I'm not sure if the regulator has been laying in the bottom of the tank for some time or it just happened the day it quit starting.

    But putting it back in place didn't fix the problem.

    Will check those hoses on my days off and maybe even try to read the codes

    ... I've learned more about this machine in the last two days than I have in the last 8 years
    .

  6. #6
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    When the fuel pump regulator falls out, the fuel pressure immediately drops to just 1-2PSI, and the engine will usually run very rough, especially above idle speed, with not much power.

    Sometimes the regulator gets knocked out of place by a hard landing or wave impact.

    It is still curious to me that the no-start problem happened at the same time as the fuel pressure regulator problem.

    How long did the machine sit after it developed the no-start problem?


    Do you keep it at a dock, or trailer it to/from the lake?

    When you say it became hard to start, what does that mean? A few more seconds of cranking before it would light up, or a LOT of extra cranking?

    Does it sputter and run roughly for a few seconds, or even die, or does it start running smoothly once it does catch?

    How long ago are we talking about?

    How recently did you un-winterize it?
    Any possibility of freeze damage?

    You do know that you need to tilt the nose of the ski up on the trailer quite high to get all the water to drain out of the stator cover and EMM - correct?

    Did you notice if there was any water leaks into the hull while the engine was running?
    Sometimes the normal continuous operation of the bilge pump will cover up a water leak.

  7. #7
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur1
    Problem history;

    I rode the machine out to an island at around noon and shut it off myself. When I went to leave at 5 it would just crank over but not fire.

    Since I was 7 miles out and alone with my family at the time I cranked it over and over trying different things [resetting fuses, different throttle positions etc.] until I finally killed the battery.
    It was surprising how long I could crank it over before the battery finally died [15 minutes].

    We were eventually towed in by a pontoon boat that happened by. When I got the machine home and on a trailer I primed the carbs and it fired right away and would rev up and everything.

    I could stop and start it as much as I wanted as long as I didn't wait more than 10 seconds between attempts. If I did this I would have to reprime it.

    If I had known about unplugging one injector at the time I could have done this started it on 2 then plugged it in and drove it home.

    it wasn't till I went on line that night and found out about the regulator problems that I took out the fuel pump and found the regulator had fallen out. I actually thought this was my problem but after fixing it I still have the same no start problem.

    The machine is put in the water in late May and stays in the water moored on a bouy till late September.I average about 40 hours riding a summer.

    If there was a leak i probably would have caught it because the machine is in the water all the time and i regularly check the hull.

    A few years ago the speedo hose was leaking right under the PTO and although it was hard to find I eventually did find it.

    The first hard start of the day I was talking about was at least 10 or 15 seconds of cranking to get it to fire.
    once it did I could run it all day starting and stopping for minutes or hours with no problems or misses or anything. Full performance once it has started.

    I bought the led light to try my luck decoding on my way home and I'm off for 4 now so we'll see what I can find out

    I guess this machine is going to be a hobby now instead of a toy.

    I'm also going to check all connections and hoses

    If you looked either under the seat or at the top of this machine you would think it has no hours on it. It looks brand new.
    It would be great to have a thread in the General Section for others to see your story.

    Several hundred hours, with minimal maintenance, stored in the water all summer for 7 years. Still looks good, and ran well until just recently.

    The current problem is fixable, one way or another, and then I expect it will continue to provide good service for you.

    If you are OK with it, I would like to post this up. Let me know

  8. #8
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    LED Decoder worked perfect
    Codes 17 and 51 came up

    checked all wires and connections -OK

    Removed EMM
    Removed cover
    Looks a little burnt by top water inlet

    Emailed DFI
    Waiting to hear back

    Feel free to post
    What looks burnt?

    The actual water hose nipple, or the circuit board under the gel?

    Perhaps you could take a couple of photos

    I will create the thread shortly - it has been busy around here...

    DFI can sometimes be slow to respond. If you don't hear back within a day or so, give them a call.

    Make note of the serial number on your EMM (near the big connector), just in case they lose track of it.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur1
    The circuit board under the gel looks burnt

    I just used the nipple as a reference point [A little below and to the left of the nipple]

    the gel looks sunk in here and the cover has gel on it in the same spot

    ...I also noticed a burnt smell to the unit
    Burnt smell, burnt gel, looks like DFI will have little trouble finding the problem area

  10. #10
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    UUMMMMMM............. Welcome to Green Hulk wilbur ...?

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