Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13
  1. #1
    urugol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,231
    +1
    3

    MSX - To buy or not to buy?

    I have a guy down the road from me selling an MSX110 which could be a nice project. Heres the link:

    http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI....=STRK:MEWAX:IT

    I rang him and he told me the marine mechanic pulled the engine and he then opted to take it back with the engine out. I assume he got a nasty shock when told how much to fix. He doesn't know what is wrong with it, all he mentioned was that the engine would not turn when starting which could mean something is bent in there.

    I have heard some debate about these engines being too complex and some members have done domestic 1200 conversions etc. Just looking for opinions on this, if it goes for a good price I wouldn't mind taking on a long term project sourcing cheap parts as they become available.


  2. #2

    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Bullhead City AZ.
    Posts
    451
    +1
    2
    I have one of these MSX 110's that I bought and turned it into a MSX 140 Carb model I used a 140 engine and standard 1200 carb parts there are few guys that have done it. Its a lot of WORK I made my engine mount there is a lot things that you will need if you could find a Running boat with a 1050 or 1200 engine and take all the parts you need off o fit that would be best.
    On the Price he wants a BUY IT NOW of 3000.00 he's NUTS I paid 600.00 for mine and sold all the stuff like the engine and turbo stuff like that and made my money back but that was a pain in the a_s but once I got done selling all stuff I was even on the Hull.
    If you need help with this there are few threads on doing the conversion Keddano did one.
    A lot of Guys install the Seadoo 215hp 4 stroke engine but the same thing it would be best to get a running ski and take what you need.
    Donít spend to much money on the MSX 110 but if you close and can pick it up you should do well at 500-700.00
    Good Luck
    Doug

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Bullhead City AZ.
    Posts
    451
    +1
    2
    I will be Posting Pics on my MSX 110 Conversion soon when i get mine re-done i doing some new mounts for it.

    Doug

  4. #4
    urugol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,231
    +1
    3
    So whats up with these webber engines, are they not worth repairing? My understanding from four strokes is that they should be a lot more reliable than 2 strokes. I haven't heard any good comments regarding reliability on these models as yet.

    There is always the opportunity to pick up an msx-150 engine for around 2K for a much easier transplant. The fact that people don't choose to go with the same powerplant raises some reliability concerns for sure.

    I would never pay 3 grand for this thing. I'm thinking 1K tops.

  5. #5
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    near Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    36,584
    +1
    1,272

    Arrow Weber engine reliability perspective

    Quote Originally Posted by urugol View Post
    So whats up with these Weber engines, are they not worth repairing?

    My understanding from four strokes is that they should be a lot more reliable than 2 strokes.

    I haven't heard any good comments regarding reliability on these models as yet...
    Others around here have more complete knowledge and hands on experience. If I have something incorrect or inaccurate, just let me know.

    When they are running well, owners tend to really like them. The combination of turbocharged power with fuel economy from a compact engine package has appeal.

    It seems that the Weber MPE750 engines as installed in the Polaris MSX 150 and MSX 110 are labor intensive to service, and replacement parts tend to be expensive.

    The availability of competent Weber engine techs is much lower than for other engines, so many shops simply turn them away when they do not have any staff that are Weber trained.

    If the core engine is damaged, rebuilds tend to be expensive. Replacement engines are not widely available unless you know how to convert one from snowmobile or other non-Polaris configurations.

    There are some good Weber engine service shops around, and these engines can be configured to run reliably.

    The stock ECU calibration runs very fuel rich, which is suspected to be a contributing factor in the Nicasil cylinder plating failures which can occur.

    The turbo-charger and waste-gate configuration has some lubrication issues. These can be alleviated with some machine shop re-work and component upgrades.

    There is an upper limit to how much more power can be drawn from the Weber 750cc engine, short of extensive modifications.

    For those faced with an expensive Weber engine rebuild/replacement, the opportunity to switch to a different engine type that is either simpler or has more power potential can be appealing.

    Hence the conversions using Polaris 1200cc 2-stroke and SeaDoo 4-Tec engines.

    It is certainly more work to install a different engine type than to re-install a working Weber engine.

    Have a look here;
    Offering ECU upgrades -- MSX150 & MSX110

    MSX 110 Help Please

    If I had an MSX 150 (or MSX 110) on hand in undamaged condition I would have the ECU and turbo upgraded, and the waste gate lubrication re-worked.

    The oil tank would be upgraded to the newer design, along with the waste gate solenoid.

    Anything else Randy, Jay or desperado suggested would be also be considered

    Then I would enjoy the MSX hull's ride, the power and speed of the upgraded turbo+ECU, and the extended cruise range of the large stock 67 liter fuel tank combined with the improved fuel consumption.

  6. #6
    urugol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,231
    +1
    3
    As always K, your perspective is impeccable

    I'm going to take a look at it. If I can pick it up for a steal I may just buy it for a long term project then think about what I will do.

    In good running condition these things are worth 6-7k over here.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Bullhead City AZ.
    Posts
    451
    +1
    2
    Did you go and look at the MSX yet??

  8. #8
    urugol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,231
    +1
    3
    I'm going down tonight. It looks like the thing has been gutted from the engine to the pump. I researched some specs and it appears the engine on the msx110/150 is exactly the same in many respects however the 150 performs a whole lot better. Is this due to cdi timing and increased boost? Not sure why one would buy a 110 over a 150 when new given the performance difference, perhaps the price difference was big at the time.

    Also had a quick look at oem parts on line. The turbo itself goes for $2,100 alone!!!

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Bullhead City AZ.
    Posts
    451
    +1
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by urugol View Post
    I'm going down tonight. It looks like the thing has been gutted from the engine to the pump. I researched some specs and it appears the engine on the msx110/150 is exactly the same in many respects however the 150 performs a whole lot better. Is this due to cdi timing and increased boost? Not sure why one would buy a 110 over a 150 when new given the performance difference, perhaps the price difference was big at the time.

    Also had a quick look at oem parts on line. The turbo itself goes for $2,100 alone!!!
    Yea your right on the Spec's and I’m sure the turbo is very pricy I herd Randy at Watcon.com has Turbo’s for them but not sure.
    If you can get this thing cheap it would be a good deal and like I say part it out the engine, turbo, wiring harness, Ext that your not going to need to do the 1200 conversion your should break even or make some money.
    Make sure when you go to look at it check the turbo see if the impeller shaft is loose and if it spins freely or not if it spins and bearing are not loose I would think you have 50-75% chance the turbo is good most of this time I have found these MSX 110 and 150's have a problem with running because of the poor cylinder plating it tends to flake off you can have the block re-plated out here in the USA we have any cylinder plating services I use Millennium Technologies there the best out here but you will need to find some one out your way if your going to fix this MSX Search Nikasil cylinder replating in your area.
    If your going to convert it you good.
    GOOD LUCK

  10. #10
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    near Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    36,584
    +1
    1,272
    Quote Originally Posted by urugol View Post
    I'm going down tonight. It looks like the thing has been gutted from the engine to the pump.
    What do you mean by 'gutted'?
    Parts removed and sold off?

    I researched some specs and it appears the engine on the msx110/150 is exactly the same in many respects however the 150 performs a whole lot better. Is this due to cdi timing and increased boost?

    Also had a quick look at oem parts on line. The turbo itself goes for $2,100 alone!!!
    The MSX 150 uses the same turbocharger, but has a higher boost limit and a blow-off valve (IIRC).

    The MSX 150 ECU allows higher maximum boost levels, hence more power.

    Desperado's turbo cartridge upgrade might be the way to go if the existing turbo is not good. The ECU re-flash upgrade is very worthwhile.

    Jay also has some offerings for the MSX Weber engine.

    The same, or very similar, turbocharger cartridge is used in some other engines, so there are alternate sources to official Polaris.

    If the Nicasil cylinder plating has started to fail, that is a lot of work to pull the engine out and strip it down. Then send it to a cylinder replating service, then rebuild the whole engine using a number of new parts...

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. To Buy or Not??
    By verrettej in forum Polaris How To & FAQs
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 08-02-2008, 10:08 PM
  2. To Buy Or Not to Buy, That Is The Question?
    By FL03GTX in forum Polaris Open Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 06-09-2008, 12:56 PM
  3. to buy or not
    By scott o in forum 2-Stroke Performance
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-11-2007, 08:02 PM
  4. To buy extended warranty or not to buy?
    By oklagp1200r in forum 4-Tec Performance
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 02-05-2007, 01:35 AM
  5. To sale or not to sale= to buy or not to buy
    By jetskr in forum Kawasaki PWC Performance (2-stroke)
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-29-2007, 11:03 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •