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  1. #1
    cmgww's Avatar
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    Why no love for GroupK?

    Just wondering...I rarely ever hear GroupK mentioned on these forums (esp. 2 stroke)....We've had great results from them over the years...Is it b/c they are west coast based? I know they can be slow (small shop), and have not updated to 4 strokes as far as I can tell....But I almost never hear about them on here...They helped make my 1993 SJ into a 58 MPH RXP killer (off the line until 40 or so....), and my bro's WaveBlaster just as fast with their 760 kits....It's where Dad sent his 1200 to be bored and ported to 1390cc....(those reading my "Help me beat Dad" thread...I have since found out he wants his 1390 de-tuned a bit for reliability; he's fine running 75 b/c with his holeshot he kills RXPs out of the hole and they can't catch up, even the new 260s)

    Just wondering, has GroupK fallen behind the times? I know they don't really specialize in 4 strokes, but my bro and I both got tremendous gains from our Blaster/SJ.....


  2. #2

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    This is just my opinion.

    Group K does exceptional work. Their work seems to be more geared to increasing performance up to the point where reliability is not sacrificed. I'm sure they can build a fire breather just like many other people in the profession, but it does not seem to be their thing. The Klemm boys have worked on 3 of my engines through the years, and always the work has been as advertised. They also have a tendency to try to get the most out of OEM parts, rather than buying aftermarket, giving the customer more bang for the buck. If you read about some of their work on their web sight, you will get great insight as to why certain engines have limitations and in general, a way to get around the problem.



    I may be parroting what I have read here, but I believe the strategy for Group K is to stay with 2 strokes because there is plenty of work out there for them to stay busy.

  3. #3
    cmgww's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by salty View Post
    This is just my opinion.

    Group K does exceptional work. Their work seems to be more geared to increasing performance up to the point where reliability is not sacrificed. I'm sure they can build a fire breather just like many other people in the profession, but it does not seem to be their thing. The Klemm boys have worked on 3 of my engines through the years, and always the work has been as advertised. They also have a tendency to try to get the most out of OEM parts, rather than buying aftermarket, giving the customer more bang for the buck. If you read about some of their work on their web sight, you will get great insight as to why certain engines have limitations and in general, a way to get around the problem.



    I may be parroting what I have read here, but I believe the strategy for Group K is to stay with 2 strokes because there is plenty of work out there for them to stay busy.
    Good points...yeah the information on their site is very comprehensive...And being a smaller shop they have plenty of work to keep them busy. But you are right about the reliability thing, other than our first Wave3 (yes I said Wave3) that we had done, their work has always been great....and the W3 was our fault b/c we asked for too much compression (180 psi) for pump gas....this was in the early days before dad really knew his stuff. We blew that thing sky high. But that wasn't their fault...Got the engine rebuilt by GK and lowered the compression, and we had a 52 MPH Wave3...That thing was a beast out of the hole too for its time (big pump for skis back then). I used to beat Raider 1100s out of the hole, XPs too. It was a wild ride!

  4. #4
    GoFastGuru's Avatar
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    alot of ideas for the rec rider got alot of info on the old boats in the bang for the buck world

  5. #5

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    s

    I will tell you my group-k adventure. I had three of my Gr's sent to them for 1390 motors 91 octane new 05 pumps sand the bottoms , jet wing sponsors and few other things. I'm not quite exactly sure how long they had them but it was somewhere around 3 to 4 months before they were done. They also were replacing the cranks with new OEM as my skis had alto of hours on them and one of them had a broken crank when I sent it there. I wanted them trued and welded but they could not seem to get that done for me something about his crank guy not having time or something but harry said they really did not need them. I went to his shop to pick them up when they were done and to ride on the Colorado river for a few day's. This is were the fun started. The first day out on the way back from one of the casinos I got ahead of my other two ski's that my friend's were riding. I turned around and went back to find one of them completely sunk. The front end was sticking out of the water and my friend was hanging onto it. They had put the jet works valve in back wards and the exhaust melted and sank. a sheriff came by and pulled it out for me. I got the water out and motor running that night and harry fixed the melted free flow the next morning and we went back out again to ride. Then one of the other skis broke down and we had to tow it back in. I ended up leaving that ski with harry to fix and had to pay someone to go get it a month later since I live in Ca. There is alto of other stuff that happen since then but this is getting pretty long. If you wanna here the rest of the story ask and a
    i will keep going.
    Last edited by thrasher63; 08-30-2010 at 08:39 PM. Reason: spelling

  6. #6
    "just sayin".. jetdave56's Avatar
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    Yes keep going...there is two sides to every story and Group Ks not here to answer..at least not yet, but its good to hear the good and the bad from customers regarding work done by the pro tuners....

  7. #7
    DAGO RACING CREW 97GPSLEEPER's Avatar
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    All I can tell you is I have a Group K motor with 260 hrs on it in my 97, the compression is still good, and I have a few trophy's on my shop wall. They delivered for me.

  8. #8
    Eastside Powersports Slow 91's Avatar
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    I have never personally done business with GroupK but i all i can say is it doesnt matter how great a company is, everyone has a failure rate. Its how they handle that failure that makes them who they are. If i mismachined a cylinder, or had an engine failure i will stand by my work 100%. Alot of people use the term "high performance has no warrenty" I try and help out any way i can rather than run away from it.

  9. #9

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    Harry and his brother are both very nice people I am just telling my story. having one ski sink the first day and the other one break down the second was a bummer considering I had just handed over close to 19 thou too him for all the work and parts. After all the probes were worked out I ended up getting 80 hr out of one ski till the rear cylinder went. I got close to a 90 hours on the other and lost the front cylinder the third ski is still running strong with 73 hrs on it. The problem that kind of bummed me out is when I got the first repaired cylinder back they didn't lock tight or tighten the valve down enough and it drooped the valve before I got even half a tank through. A called and he said sorry send it back to them to fix had to get a new piston and the cylinder fixed and got charged over again for ever thing. I kinda thought he should have worked with me a little on that at least the labor part. But he didn't offer and I am not the type of person to ask. Then I sent him my cabs to rebuild over the winter. I got my cabs back and the first time out it seized. It looked like it wasn't getting any fuel. this ski is Prue mix. In the mean time I had been talking to Osidebill about ever thing. So I sent him my rebuilt carbs that I just got back from group-k. He took them apart and found the wrong pumps installed and they were already creased. Bill posted about this if you want to read what he found in my carbs that had just been rebuilt by group-k. I called harry back again to tell him and he said they can still work with the undersized parts they put in but not for long. and he also told me that I just got a parshall rebuild on the cabs what ever that means. Did'nt offer to give me any money back for the shit carb work or for the piston and cylinder and head that went. I think harry and gerhart his brother are very nice people but I do not think they were looking over the people they had working for them. I know they are very Knowledgable I just did'nt care for the service they profided me considering how much money I spent with them. If I were ever to do it agian all my work would go thru mr. Horning and Osidebill. Sorry for all the grammar mistakes. lol

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slow 91 View Post
    I have never personally done business with GroupK but i all i can say is it doesnt matter how great a company is, everyone has a failure rate. Its how they handle that failure that makes them who they are. If i mismachined a cylinder, or had an engine failure i will stand by my work 100%. Alot of people use the term "high performance has no warrenty" I try and help out any way i can rather than run away from it.

    I agree completely. Group K did help me in a lot of ways other than working an engine and shipping it to me. I had a 65U engine ported by group K and did everything I knew to tear it up by endurance racing (locally) and jumping waves. It finally threw a rod through the cases after about 300hrs. How do you complain about that?

    Took a National championship trophy home from Sanduski Ohio one year in endurance racing using a Group K Sleeper II ported engine in a GP1200R. After putting 107hrs of extreemly hard riding over the span of 10 months, the engine looked perfect. A lot can be said about reliablilty.

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