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  1. #1

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    MSX110 - Low Compression / Nicasil Plating

    Compression is about 25 PSI in both cylinders. There are little silver flakes in the exhaust ports on the head. If I crank the motor by hand until the valves open, I can look inside and see that the cylinder walls are the same color as the silver flakes, but there are darker spots, presumably where the plating has flaked off.

    Would the plating problem cause the compression to be so low, or should I be looking at something else? I'm probably going to part out this ski, but before I do, I'd like to get an idea what would be involved in rebuilding the motor. Judging by the difficulty in just pulling the motor, I'm guessing that rebuilding is not going to be easy.

    The cam chain breaking tool costs $400. Is there any problem with just cutting one link, or grinding out the pins on one link? I don't want to spend $400 just to take a peek inside. If I decide to rebuild, is there another way of installing the new link without the tool?

    What a waste... this ski has 19 hours on it.
    Last edited by grumpy_steven; 02-02-2011 at 05:02 AM.


  2. #2
    Kosh's Avatar
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    Yes, the nickasil sticks in the ring gap = low compression, this is a common fault. Resleve the block and you will be OK. Use a grinder to part the chain and a hammer and punch to deform it when you put it back together.With a new link ($5)

    Darton made a sleeve specifically for this motor because of the flaking problem.

    Cheers

  3. #3

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    I see that Watcon has the sleeves for $150 each. Add installation, shipping and whatever else I may need to get this ski running and the repair cost will probably come close to the $1420 NADA average retail value for the ski.

    Had a thought... what if I use a cylinder hone to remove all of the nicasil plating, then just re-assemble the motor? I'm sure the bare cylinder walls won't hold up as well as the plated walls or the sleeves, but it should work. The only question would be whether engine failure would be imminent.

  4. #4
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grumpy_steven View Post
    I see that Watcon has the sleeves for $150 each. Add installation, shipping and whatever else I may need to get this ski running and the repair cost will probably come close to the $1420 NADA average retail value for the ski.

    Had a thought... what if I use a cylinder hone to remove all of the nicasil plating, then just re-assemble the motor? I'm sure the bare cylinder walls won't hold up as well as the plated walls or the sleeves, but it should work. The only question would be whether engine failure would be imminent.
    NADA values for Polaris PWC tend to be lower than actual market value.

    Nicasil is a hard coating on an aluminum cylinder. Removing the hard coating will expose the soft aluminum which will not work.

    When they are running well, owners of the Weber engined MSX models tend to love them.

    You also have the option of upgrading the engine with Desperado's ECU reflash, and upgrading the inter-cooler, or even the turbo.

    My signature links have more info

  5. #5

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    I'm sure the plating is there for a reason, but I wonder how long the engine would run without it. If I could get a season out of it, I could then decide if it's worth the additional investment. What would happen... cylinders get scored and need to be re-sleeved, or would the pistons seize up in the cylinders and send a con-rod thru the block?

    I've already put too much time into this ski. I thought I got a great deal on it, but if I could get my money back, I'd let it go and invest in a ski that's easier to work on and get parts for. It was easier to do a complete rebuild on a Kawi 4-stroke than it was to get this motor out.

    I'm going to pull the motor apart and get a price on the complete re-sleeve job from Watcon. I'll probably end up parting out the ski. It looks like I can get my money back by selling the head and the turbo unit. I don't see much demand for the rest of the parts, but anything else I sold would be compensation for the time invested in the ski.

    I do like the hull design of this ski. Is there another motor that can be dropped in?

  6. #6
    seaobin's Avatar
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    Steven,

    The aluminum cylinders would give way to the heat and friction, hence the coating

  7. #7
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Arrow Polaris MSX hull conversion projects using Sea-Doo 4-Tec engines

    Quote Originally Posted by grumpy_steven View Post
    ...how long the engine would run without it...

    I do like the hull design of this ski. Is there another motor that can be dropped in?
    Without the Nicasil coating in the cylinders the engine will experience extreme and rapid cylinder wall wear. These are not iron cylinders, they are soft aluminum underneath the hard Nicasil coating.

    There are several conversion projects involving a Sea-Doo 4-Tec engine in an MSX hull.

    Have a look at Beerdart's MSX 1500SC Project, and HydroToys has one in progress. GGG also has his 4-tec powered MSX

  8. #8
    Watcon's Avatar
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    KOSH Message.
    Can you contact me directly at [email protected]?

    Thanks,
    Randy

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by K447 View Post
    There are several conversion projects involving a Sea-Doo 4-Tec engine in an MSX hull.

    Have a look at Beerdart's MSX 1500SC Project, and HydroToys has one in progress. GGG also has his 4-tec powered MSX
    I was thinking more along the lines of a cheap 2-stroke motor, maybe picking up an old Kawasaki with a beat-up hull (there are plenty of them around here). I wouldn't want to spend much on a donor ski... and a 4-stroke SeaDoo is going to cost a few grand.

    I'm probably going to go the part-out route. If you need something, let me know.

  10. #10
    ujustlost's Avatar
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    It was before my time but i think chevy tested the all aluminum block with no sleeves on the vega and the motors started to go at 20,000 miles

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