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  1. #1
    AquaGuy's Avatar
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    Why did 2 stroke disapear from watercraft but not snowmobiles?

    I am sitting here researching Ski-Doo snowmobiles and to my surprise 2 strokes are still alive and well in the snowmobile market. So my question is why did they get completly phased out in watercraft while evolving into clean and fuel efficient engineering marvels in snowmobiles? Couldn't the big three have put the clean E-Tecs alongside with the four strokes in PWCs too?

    http://www.ski-doo.com/en-US/Technologies/Index.htm#


  2. #2
    GOT BOOST? Dockside's Avatar
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    4 strokes are the future, just taking longer in the sleds. Turbo skidoo

  3. #3
    Chaserxp215's Avatar
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    I think there is alot of opposition to 4 stroke sleds. I always loved a 2 stroke sled and still will. I rode a 4 stroke the other day and I was very shocked and how quiet etc... I somewhat enjoyed it but I will be staying with a 2 stroke for awhile just because of the weight issue. Adding 100 pounds to a 400 pound feels like a huge difference. The other issue is when you are snowmobiling there is usually not many people around out in the middle of the woods. In the summer many people are enjoying the lake and want peace and quiet. I love being able to idle around the lake and have a conversation with the person next to me. Its nice having a quiet jet ski and a loud sled lol. JMO

  4. #4
    raiderx72's Avatar
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    Its the same as with motocross. I always swore I would keep the faith with my yz250. I then rode a yz450f I promptly switched to a 4 stroke. The delivery of the power was smoother and a wider power band. I think a lot has to do with the low end grunt of a 4 stroke. As with the skis I had a 1100zxi and loved it but when it came to getting power out of it everything I did really took the reliability out of the ski.

  5. #5
    YoYamma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AquaGuy View Post
    I am sitting here researching Ski-Doo snowmobiles and to my surprise 2 strokes are still alive and well in the snowmobile market. So my question is why did they get completly phased out in watercraft while evolving into clean and fuel efficient engineering marvels in snowmobiles? Couldn't the big three have put the clean E-Tecs alongside with the four strokes in PWCs too?
    I think they could have, but it was a matter of timing. According to Wiki, Bombardier didn't acquire the Evinrude and Jonhson brands until 2003, so I guess they were a long way from getting one ready for the PWC market. At that time, the shift to 4 stroke PWC was already well underway, a result of the industry trying to simply survive the onslaught of the radical greens like Bluewater Network (now Friends of the Earth).

    In the late 90's, Bluewater Network worked hard to hammer the entire PWC industry into the grave. They sued the National Park Service over its policy, enacted in April 2000, which banned PWC at 66 sites and locked us out of thousands of acres of American waterways.

    That radical environmental group headed up by Russell Long, has long fought to erode the rights of PWC owners, along with restricting snowmobiles and ATV's across the nation and around the world. Russell Long hated 2 strokes, in fact he pretty much hated engines; he was a sailor. His original website featured a long list of PWC and other motorized vehicle related horror stories from the media, designed to to further his agenda of getting what he calls "motorized thrillcraft" off the waterways and increasing the hatred of our hobbies.

    No one likes pollution, but a careful review of this group will reveal a far more sweeping agenda. Some of these radicals hate anything that makes noise and has an engine. See the introduction on page one of my signature thread for more:
    http://www.greenhulk.net/forums/show...ht=snowmobiles

    Also for more on snowmobiles:
    see post 291 here:
    http://www.greenhulk.net/forums/show...les#post809959

    The latest water grab of thousands of square miles off the coast of California proves they really don't care if we have 4 strokes or not. That ban includes Sea-Doo boats up to 20 feet long! Ultimately, they want to keep boaters off the water, period. It's all about control.

  6. #6
    dhoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AquaGuy View Post
    I am sitting here researching Ski-Doo snowmobiles and to my surprise 2 strokes are still alive and well in the snowmobile market. So my question is why did they get completly phased out in watercraft while evolving into clean and fuel efficient engineering marvels in snowmobiles? Couldn't the big three have put the clean E-Tecs alongside with the four strokes in PWCs too?

    http://www.ski-doo.com/en-US/Technologies/Index.htm#
    There is still a 2stroke market in snowmobiles because most sled riders want a light sled and a 4stroke motor adds considerably to the weight. In PWCs it seems there is no market for "lighter is better".
    Also the 2 strokes work well in the sleds because of the clutching that is done to utilize the 2 stroke power band. The 4stroke market is expanding rapidly in snowmobiles though

  7. #7
    Rampage's Avatar
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    I have a couple friends who ride sleds and they said that they hate the 4 strokes, a lot of it has to do with how they sound, and a lot of it has to do with the weight as well. Its interesting how a 4 stroke on a ski can sounds so badass, but then on a sled they sound stupid.

  8. #8
    dhoad's Avatar
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    If skidoo/seadoo/brp had not come out with etec motor I think the sled market would have disappeared a lot sooner.

  9. #9
    SPEED KILLS, BUT YOU GET THERE QUICKER Keddano's Avatar
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    The 2 strokers are not as a efficent burn,so water pollution has force the PWC market. Then comes the weight issue in sleds. When it comes to speed,a low HP sled still can turn all the acceleration/MPH most people need or can really use on a trail. So a light nimble sled is easier and less tiredsome when putting alot of miles on a trail in a day. Now dragging on the ice in a smooth straight line,HP means everything.

    A extra 80# means alot when you bury one in powder snow and have to lift/drag one out.....LOL

  10. #10
    "Hustler" Inkaddict's Avatar
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    Anyone thats says 4 stroke sleds are junk never rode an Apex...

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