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  1. #1

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    2002 virage I no/rough idle

    I have a 2002 virage I 800di that won't idle properly or at all but will run WOT. It acts like it is misfiring at idle but when rev'd up it sounds fine. I have owned since 2003 bought new. It now shows 1.3hrs which is nowhere near right if I had to guess 100-150hrs would be more likely(it resets everytime the battery is disconnected).
    Four major repairs last year had to do a hull repair did a post of that here also, 6 years ago the steering post bearings/bushings replaced and warranty work done 7 years ago for the water injection solenoid blue hose that was some how cut in two and burned still haven't figure how that could of happened( has it wasn't touching anything to burn it) it was dumping water into the hull and when I got it the dealer had to redue the seal on the ride plate due to it leaking air and causing cavitation. It usually got a hesitation mid season at WOT but new plugs seemed to solve the hesitation. It has been winterized every year with fogging oil, spark plugs loosened, battery removed, water flushed with flush kit, greased coupler, water solenoid inspected cleaned and visually checked it over. Never had issue dewinterizing till this year. Over the last 4yrs has been inside a garage/shop.
    It was rode fairly hard for the first few years of ownership. It hasn't been rode much over the last 3 years do to hull damage and health issues that kept me from riding.

    Repair/sharpshooting wise Here what I have done/tried

    Add fresh fuel with seafoam additive
    New Ngk Pzfr6h Gap .032 laser platinum plugs, have good spark(seen it and felt it kind tingled), plugs when removed looks fouled out or soot covered this incudles the new pair. Appears to be running rich at idle but it being DI I have no idea what one could do to lean it out if that is even possible(got to love brain boxes) Been using last years plugs now(had very little use) while its not running right to keep from fouling up new ones
    New battery with good voltage
    Checked fuel pressure 0psi(did the repair on the pressure regulator that K447 outlined on here.) now have 20-25psi pressure
    Did manual running of fuel pump to check operation.
    tested tps no change
    tested start/stop module no change
    Checked injector voltage 27-33v on startup
    Inspected and cleaned a small amount of metal shaving off the cps, no leaks on the fuel lines but the front injector is or lower fitting on fuel line that mounts to injector body is slowly leaking(gonna need a possible fix here think it might be sucking air here which could cause an issue)
    Did the upper recommend repair for the upper fuel line rub issue.
    Removed the flame arrester/air filter to check for restriction.
    I haven't been able to check compression yet but plan to.

    Also the front motor gasket on the motor is blow out and leaking water. Is ok to use an rtv here or should I search for a gasket?

    Could it be that the EMM is needing repair or replacement?
    Would injector fitting leaking cause the misfire no/rough idle?
    Could injectors be dirty need cleaning?

    Thanks for any help I did alot of searches on green hulk. Found K447 link to Polaris pwc knowledge but not really sure if any of what I found would help me still new to working on the DI fuel systems on the polaris.

    Thanks again for any and all help!


  2. #2
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhino81 View Post
    ... 2002 Virage i 800di that won't idle properly or at all but will run WOT. It acts like it is misfiring at idle but when rev'd up it sounds fine. I have owned since 2003 bought new. ... 100-150hrs ...

    ... water injection solenoid

    ... It usually got a hesitation mid season at WOT but new plugs seemed to solve the hesitation.

    ... Repair/sharpshooting wise Here what I have done/tried

    Add fresh fuel with seafoam additive
    SeaFoam doesn't do anything useful, as best I can tell, with these engines

    New NGK Pzfr6h Gap .032 laser platinum plugs, have good spark(seen it and felt it kind tingled), plugs when removed looks fouled out or soot covered this incudles the new pair. Appears to be running rich at idle but it being DI I have no idea what one could do to lean it out if that is even possible(got to love brain boxes) Been using last years plugs now (had very little use) while its not running right to keep from fouling up new ones
    Sometimes even spark plugs that 'look good' can cause trouble. You may want to swap in fresh plugs to see if it makes any difference. Also check the spark plug wires and ignition coils for correct ohm readings.

    New battery with good voltage
    Checked fuel pressure 0psi(did the repair on the pressure regulator that K447 outlined on here.) now have 20-25psi pressure
    Did manual running of fuel pump to check operation.

    tested TPS no change
    It is not possible to reliably bench test a TPS. Engine vibration and heat can cause a TPS to fail on the running engine, but test good when the engine is not running, or the TPS is on the work bench.

    tested start/stop module no change

    Checked injector voltage 27-33v on startup
    When did you measure that voltage? While the engine was cranking, or after it was running?

    When running (with both injectors plugged in and operating) the fuel injector voltage on White/Red wire should be right around 45 volts DC, and remain fairly stable across the RPM range.


    Inspected and cleaned a small amount of metal shaving off the cps,

    no leaks on the fuel lines but the front injector is or lower fitting on fuel line that mounts to injector body is slowly leaking (gonna need a possible fix here think it might be sucking air here which could cause an issue)
    The fuel system is pressurized, so any leaks will result in fuel coming out, not air going in. Was the fuel hose damaged from rubbing on the bracket before you applied the plastic sheathing?

    You may need to replace the small o-rings that seal the fuel line connections into the injector. Not expensive or that hard to do. Release pressure at the schrader valve before pulling the injector brackets off.

    Inspect the fuel line clamps and the plastic tee for cracks or leaking.

    Inspect the injector carefully for cracks or other problems. Do not over tighten the injector bolts, and snug them up evenly to avoid twisting the injector itself.


    Did the upper recommend repair for the upper fuel line rub issue.

    Removed the flame arrester/air filter to check for restriction.
    I haven't been able to check compression yet but plan to.

    Also the front motor gasket on the motor is blow out and leaking water. Is ok to use an rtv here or should I search for a gasket?

    Could it be that the EMM is needing repair or replacement?
    Would injector fitting leaking cause the misfire no/rough idle?
    Could injectors be dirty need cleaning?
    From what you have described, I would be changing the TPS to a new or known good TPS. The TPS is one part that cannot be worked around. If it is bad, it can cause all manner of strange problems.

    Worst case is you end up with a spare good TPS, which is a good thing.

    I suggest you remove the front half of the flywheel housing (item 22 in diagram). You have a water leak, and have found some metal shavings on the CPS. Together, that seems like reason enough to inspect further.

    Be careful not to lose track of any of the washers/bushings that hold the Bendix shaft in position.

    You can purchase replacement gaskets (5812011) for the water jacket cover (item 15) and the main housing seal (5811550).

    While you have it apart, inspect and clean all the fittings and small hoses for the water cooling. That water also flows through and cools the EMM itself, so any blockages will result in an overheated EMM.

    With the flywheel cover off, look for further signs of metal debris. If there is debris, and especially if it is magnetic, then you really want to pull the flywheel off and inspect for damage to the flywheel magnets. Also inspect the stator for damage.

    My guesses at this point;
    - TPS has gone bad
    - Flywheel failure and/or magneto stator damage

    - EMM needs repair (depends on what happens when the first two are addressed)

    - The Ficht RAM fuel injectors rarely need cleaning. Further, they work differently than typical automotive injectors, and are not cleaned the same way. Lets assume the injectors are OK for the moment.


  3. #3
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    It might be helpful to use the LED tool to read the codes from the EMM. After reading the codes, clear them.

    Then run the engine, shut it down, and see what codes reoccur.

  4. #4

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    Ok so start by ordering new TPS for possible def. Or at least have an xtra on hand. Also get both gaskets for front crankcase to repair leak and inspect stator/ flywheel for damage.

    I also looked up the fuel system parts and plan to order o-rings that go on the injector body there is a leak from one that could cause an issue.

    How can you tell if there is a eng code?
    Is the only way to find them with a computer or the led tool you posted about?

    I know that unplugging the Tps caused flashing red light on MFi and check eng on display.

    Thanks for help k447 you have alot of great info that has helped so far!
    I'll post what I find out now I'll be waiting on some parts but I will be pulling the front cover to do the inspection soon.

  5. #5

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    Looked up tps on parts pit stop not sure what order if it can still be order there the diagram looks like a carb version. Is there somewhere else to look for it?

  6. #6
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhino81 View Post
    Looked up TPS on parts pit stop not sure what order if it can still be order there the diagram looks like a carb version. Is there somewhere else to look for it?
    Have you reviewed the Ficht engine link from my signature? It lists the correct TPS version and part number you need (2202740).

    PartsPitStop is listing the 2202740 TPS for $127

    If my links don't include the part numbers, then the best way is to use the Polaris Industries web site to find the original part numbers (and sometimes the replacement/supersede part number), then search for those part numbers on the Parts Sources web sites.

  7. #7
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhino81 View Post
    ... gaskets for front crankcase to repair leak and inspect stator/ flywheel for damage.

    I also looked up the fuel system parts and plan to order o-rings that go on the injector body there is a leak from one that could cause an issue.

    How can you tell if there is a eng code?
    Is the only way to find them with a computer or the led tool you posted about?

    I know that unplugging the Tps caused flashing red light on MFi and check eng on display.

    Thanks for help k447 you have alot of great info that has helped so far!
    I'll post what I find out now I'll be waiting on some parts but I will be pulling the front cover to do the inspection soon.
    The only way to see what trouble codes are waiting, if any, is to read them out.

    If a problem is happening right now while the engine is running, and it is considered a 'hard code' that is affects engine operation right now, then the RED warning light on the MFI will flash. But it won't tell you what the problem is.

    As soon as the 'hard code' problem goes away the red flashing light also goes out. The code is still stored in the EMM.

    Be careful with the fuel injector o-rings. There is a huge fat o-ring that sits on top of the injector, underneath the metal bracket. It doesn't seal anything, but is simply a rubber 'cushion' that clamps the injector down onto the cylinder head.

    It is supposed to be glued up under the bracket (which may be why it doesn't seem to have a separate part number ), but often the glue comes loose. Make sure that o-ring is in position on top of the injector when you put the injector back together.

    There is no o-ring between the injector and the cylinder head. That seal is a direct metal-to-metal precision fit, which is why the injectors must be tightened carefully to maintain the alignment.

    The tiny o-rings that seal the fuel lines into the injectors are used in pairs (four per injector). There is one larger size for the fuel supply line, and a different smaller size for the fuel return line. You can find them under both Polaris and Kawasaki part numbers. Items 15 and 17 in the diagram.

    Fuel injector to fuel line o-rings
    Kawasaki # ------- Polaris #
    92055-3758 (outlet) 5411599 O-Ring, DFI Fitting, Small
    92055-3759 (inlet) 5411601 O-Ring, DFI Fitting, Large


  8. #8

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    Ok thanks for the info plan is now to order all but the tps as it will have to wait till I get paid again. I did find it on Partsland for $87 if they still got it dam there high for something that seem to be goin out for alot of people and with no way to test it seems like throwing money way if it doesn't fix anything but do have itnon hand when it does.

    But I can eliminate the fuel leak and water leak and inspect the stator/flywheel.

    Is there any need to remove the injector to replace fuel line o-rings? Both the large and small will be replaced.
    Also work on get a led tool to find any EMM trouble codes and go from there.

    Again thanks for the help and info I'd let lost without it k447

  9. #9
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Arrow How to remove Ficht fuel injectors, and how to replace the fuel line o-rings

    Quote Originally Posted by rhino81 View Post
    ... Is there any need to remove the injector to replace fuel line o-rings?

    Both the large and small will be replaced...
    The injector can stay where it is, but the metal bracket holding it down must be lifted off. The bracket has tangs that hold the fuel lines in place, so to release the fuel connections the bracket must be wiggled up and off.

    Make sure the lanyard is out.

    Press on the pin inside the schrader valve to release any fuel pressure. Hold a cloth to catch any fuel spray.

    Now you can loosen the injector bolts evenly, then take them out.

    Be careful nothing falls down as you work. You might want to stuff a towel along each side of the engine top before you start working.

    Then hold the injector body while you wiggle the bracket up and off. Watch for the large o-ring that sits under the bracket cap.

    Now you can hold the injector while wiggling each fuel line tee free from the injector. Some fuel may dribble out from each injector, so be ready to soak it up with a shop rag.

    Be careful how you dispose of the flammable rags afterwards. BTW, no smoking allowed while working with the fuel system.

    Since the fuel hoses between injectors are so short, you will probably have to do this with both injectors, just to have working room. The o-rings are very small to work with.

    Before you lift them off, mark the front injector body with MAG, and the rear injector body with PTO. This will ensure they go back onto the correct cylinders, which is important.

    Now you can inspect the injector that was leaking. Look for any signs of cracks where the fuel liens connect. More fuel may spill out when you turn it over, so hold it with a cloth.

    When removing the old o-rings, you may have to damage them to get them out of the little grooves. The important thing is to not damage the plastic grooves. Any scratches or dings may result in leaks, even with the new o-rings. If you want to be safe, order replacement plastic connectors when you order the o-rings.

  10. #10

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    K447,
    Well I overlooked the highlighted areas on ur responses.
    To answer the ?'s the voltage on the injectors was taken during cranking not running I'll need to retest here.
    Tried the new spark plugs same result.
    Fuel hoses have rub marks but no leaks yet.

    Where did u locate the deutsch 12p/8p connectors I did a quick search? Most supplier requie an acct or min order with no prices. I would rather build a oem style tool to use vs try to rig up something I could have trouble using.

    I plan to replace the o-ring and connects that way there is no issue of creating a leak. When one puts the injectors back together what have you found to be the easiest/best way to keep them meshed/evenly flat against the head properly?

    Sorry for all the ? I just trying to make sure it's done properly so it doesn't bite me.
    Thanks Doesn't even do justice to the amount of help you provided here and thru the link that you have.
    Last edited by rhino81; 03-01-2011 at 10:46 AM. Reason: Add to reply

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