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  1. #1
    Site Admin MikeTrin's Avatar
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    Unhappy poor japan, poor world.

    so last year we spill billions of barrels of oil into the gulf, then spray millions of gallons of corexit on it.

    now we have at least 4 nuclear reactors on the edge of the pacific ocean that are going critical, melting fuel rods and spewing so much radiation in the air and sea that they can't even say for sure how much has escaped.

    kind of sad, i probably should go watch dancing with the stars or something to distract me from thinking about the radiation cloud that's over the USA right now...


  2. #2
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Those reactors in Japan are leaking radioactive poisons, but they are not 'going critical'.

    What this event underscores is the bet we make with nuclear energy. When it goes bad (which may not be very often) a reactor can go very, very bad. There is no significant risk from this event to any country beyond Japan itself, at least not from what is known at the moment regarding the situation. The Pacific is very wide and the increases in radiation are tiny. Measurable, but not not the main issue.

    Have a look at this radiation diagram to see how different exposure levels compare
    http://xkcd.com/radiation/

    What many people forget is that everything around us has radiation at some level. In the chart, notice the rankings for 'Living within 50 miles of a coal power plant' and 'Living in a stone, brick or concrete building'.

    The real question is how willing are we as nations to continue to live with and make further bets on the risk of nuclear power. It doesn't matter* how many plants run without incident for many years. What matters is the risks when things do go downhill. There is no upper limit to how bad a nuclear accident can get.

    In Japan the Fukushima Daiichi reactors simply lost cooling (which is a huge deal for a reactor) but they had already automatically 'shut down' the reactors when the earthquake happened an hour earlier. It could have been much worse, despite how difficult the situation currently is.

    * Actually, the problem of spent fuel accumulation and long term storage remains a huge problem. Storing spent fuel right in or beside the reactors is a poor arrangement.




  3. #3
    raiderx72's Avatar
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    from what i heard you will get more radiation from eating a single banana then what the leakage is in japan.. i dunno how true this is but i heard it on the radio the other day and almost sheet myself lol

  4. #4
    Site Admin MikeTrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by raiderx72 View Post
    from what i heard you will get more radiation from eating a single banana then what the leakage is in japan.. i dunno how true this is but i heard it on the radio the other day and almost sheet myself lol
    a banana? someone said this on the radio? wow. i'm glad i don't have cable tv or listen to the radio..

    Japan times:

    Radioactive iodine-131 readings taken from seawater near the water intake of the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear plant's No. 2 reactor reached 7.5 million times the legal limit, Tokyo Electric Power Co. admitted Tuesday.

    http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-b...0110406a1.html

    then they come out and say oh today it's down to only 5 million times the legal limit.

    there is no safe exposure to iodine 131 or ce-137 or any other man made by-product of FISSION.

    comparing natural occurring background radiation to cesium and iodine from a reactor fueled with uranium and plutonium is like comparing apples to concrete blocks. you can't do it.

    if you are really curious just put cesium 137 iodine 131 into google and click news

    not trying to panic but it's my opinion that it's a lot more serious than they are leading you to believe.

    hopefully ann coulter is right when she claims radiation is good for you.

  5. #5
    raiderx72's Avatar
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    just some information i found on the net... maybe it holds some truth.

    Bananas, by comparison, have an average radiation level of only 3520 picocuries per kg (3), although this is still high enough to place them among the more radiation-heavy foods. The source of the radiation is potassium, specifically radioactive isotope K40 inside potassium. Anything with potassium is radioactive because of this isotope, but few foods have the banana's potassium punch.

    To put this in perspective with the average dose of 360 millirems of radiation per year, if you ate a banana a day you'd take in 3.6 millirems during that year.

  6. #6
    8upwitHDs's Avatar
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    The direct exposure is one thing, but once this crap enters the food chain and starts migrating towards the US lets see how many of you want to eat fish and crab from Alaska and the rest of the Pacific. I trust this Tepco electric company about as much as I trusted BP last year. These companies only care about one thing...money, how to get it away from you and how to keep from spending it on their mistakes. Only time will tell how bad this disaster will be.

  7. #7
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTrin View Post
    ... if you are really curious just put cesium 137 iodine 131 into Google and click news

    not trying to panic but it's my opinion that it's a lot more serious than they are leading you to believe. ...
    Google yes, Google News no.

    News organizations are generally terrible with regard to accurate and relevant facts, reasoned perspective, and deeply understanding what they are talking about. One of the great challenges of our times is the greatly diminished and still rapidly shrinking quality of news organizations.

    From http://climatide.wgbh.org/category/ocean/
    * Iodine-131 (the official name for radioactive iodine) decays fairly quickly; it has a half-life of just 8 days, meaning that half of the radioactivity is gone after eight days. Even for large releases, radioactive iodine levels would be expected to fall to background levels within a matter of weeks to a few months.

    * As iodine-131 is whisked around the globe on atmospheric air currents, it quickly becomes diluted. While low levels of radioactivity from Fukushima Dai-ichi have been detected in air and rainwater around the U.S. (even here in Massachusetts), the E.P.A. stresses that levels are thousands of times below even conservative levels of concern.

    * Thatís even truer in the ocean. Oceanographer Ken Buesseler of Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution says that radioactive material would quickly become mixed throughout the top 300 feet of the ocean, then carried around the Pacific Ocean on currents. Buesseler says that, even after Chernobyl, the Black Sea remained safe for both swimming and seafood consumption, and there were no noteworthy impacts on marine life.

    * The U.S. Food and Drug Administration has said that it is monitoring seafood, milk, and produce imported from Japan, but doesnít expect contamination problems. Besides, the fishing fleet and shipping infrastructure in northeastern Japan was devastated by the earthquake and tsunami, severely limiting the availability of food products from the affected region.

    * One possible exception would be seaweed from the area immediately around the crippled plant. Seaweed contains high levels of iodine, so could concentrate the radioactive iodine. Again, this is a relatively short-term concern, primarily in Japan.
    Radioactive cesium and plutonium

    Of course, Iodine-131 is not the only radioactive material being released from the reactors at Fukushima Dai-ichi. Radioactive cesium-137 has been found in seawater near the plant, albeit at much lower levels than radioactive iodine. Cesium-137 is much longer-lived than iodine-131; itís half-life is 30 years, so it could be around for hundreds of years, making it the greater threat to marine life. However, at this point, levels of cesium-137 in seawater around Fukushima are similar to levels seen in the Black Sea after Chernobyl where (as I mentioned above) scientists saw no serious impacts on marine life.

    Questions about plutonium are also surfacing. Traces of plutonium have been found in soil samples around the nuclear power plant, and the contamination appears to have originated from the current crisis. Plutonium has a half-life of more than 24,000 years and is very dangerous if inhaled or ingested, but its radioactivity canít penetrate skin or clothes and the levels found in the soil samples were too low to pose a human health risk. But Hidehiko Nishiyama, an official from Japanís nuclear safety agency, has been quoted as saying that ďWhile itís not at a level harmful to human health, I am not optimistic. This means the containment mechanism is being breached, so I think the situation is worrisome.Ē
    The Japanese reactors are now in a very fragile and very complex state. Many of the actions taken to improve the situation bring further complexity and unknowns. Each reactor is now a separate and unique situation.

    Not only were the original reactor designs not intended to withstand the scale of earthquake that occurred, the follow-on tsunami completely wiped out the game plans for post disaster recovery.

    Many of the things that are being done now were never considered, planned or characterized. Pumping sea water inside a reactor has all sorts of unwanted side effects. Continuously pouring tons of sea water onto the upper floors where the spent pools are makes everything lower down into soggy hell.

    Aftershocks of significant magnitude continue to shake the place, and there are many tons of water inside structures that were never meant to have any water inside (and not just the basements). The shear weight and mass of the water is adding stress, even more so every time the ground shakes.

    For the Japanese, and indeed the global nuclear industry, mother nature is 'piling on'. The buildings are not mechanically stable and there is system damage and water almost everywhere. It will take concerted effort from many countries over a very long period of time to bring these things fully under control.

    It may not be daily headline news for much longer, but these things will continue to be a big deal for years and years.

    The radiation concern is mostly local to Japan, but the risks from all the other global nuclear facilities must be viewed with a deeper understanding of what 'low probability, high downside' risk really means.

    ---------- Post added at 01:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:55 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by 8upwitHDs View Post
    ... lets see how many of you want to eat fish and crab from Alaska and the rest of the Pacific...
    Most of the time we don't know where our food really comes from, even if it is labeled. Heck, we don't even know what species of fish we are eating.

    If fish from 'radioactive waters' becomes hard to sell, it will likely still arrive on store shelves somehow, possibly with a different label. Especially if the radiation levels are officially 'safe', which means there is no official reason to prevent it from being sold.

  8. #8
    flyin' the friendly skies airbornexp's Avatar
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    when I keep hearing about Japans nuke plant leaking radioactive material into the ocean I can only think of one thing.....GODZILLA!

  9. #9
    SideFX's Avatar
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  10. #10
    ride it like you stole it!!! raceneked's Avatar
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    we are all gonna die sooner or later anyway. if this really has your panties in a bunch; go fill up your ski and go for a ride. ALWAYS makes me feel better about things...

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