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  1. #1

    Totally Stumped on Start for 02 4 tec. Need EXPERTS!!!!

    While this is not performance, it is lack of it. Ive exhausted all my resourses and tech support and still clueless......her it is:

    So this is a new one to me.....2002 GTX 4 tec. 100hrs but new to me.

    Let me preface this with I have had a rental business for 12 years and have worked on skis on the side as well. So I have already tried the usual suspects.

    The ski tuns over 1/2 stroke and than acts like hydro lock or bad earth ground, but both check out. No moisture in engine and turns over fine and smooth with no "bad" sounds with PLUGS OUT. I test old battery and seems questionable so I do what should be the problem. Well, here is a flow chart of what I did:

    1. New battery, same thing. I then hook up F250 diesel with dual batteries to supplement and ski turns over but VERY slowly and cables are getting too hot. Ok.

    2. New Starter. I bench tested old one and seemed strong with good torque but had a bit much noise so I just go ahead and get a new Starter because thats what it has to be. Same thing. Turns smoothly with no plugs but with plugs in engine "locks" on first stroke.

    3. I ofcourse cleaned/inspected grounds and pos. and all good. I ran a redundant ground directly to new starter just to be 100%....same thing.

    4. Inspected impeller even though I know thats not the problem as it spun freely w/o plugs and wear ring isnt falling apart. Maybe bearings are bad but no noise when turning w/o plugs and also if they were seizing from ski sitting the engine would turn over faster after a few seconds w/o plugs after "breaking in" bearings. Ofcourse they would be bad but a rusty bearing would loosen up and then fail some time after.

    5. Inspected timing chain to see if it was dragging or tensioner was broken but all good. Everything "looked" good under valve cover. NO water in oil.

    6. Tried compression check but new it would turn over past 120 psi before locking. The compression "feels" good and was able to get 120 psi on all 3 cylinders before each one would lock at that psi. I am sure I will hit over 150 once dragging issue is resolved.

    7. I called SBT tech and they didnt know but had a meeting regarding it. They called after an hour and said there was one ski they have heard of having the same issue. They said the customer replaced bendix and problem was solved.

    I not sure Im buying that though, although at this point it has to be something that makes no sense. The gear ofcouse can disengage but this is remaining engaged. Could a bendix cause so much drag that its causing this? Ive never seen or heard of it. Thanks in advance!




  2. #2
    Moderator beerdart's Avatar
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    Interesting problem.. Have you checked cam timing and that the cam turns? It sounds like when you remove the plugs you have compression release on all three and she spins but with plugs in she is locking due to compression on more then one cylinder. Just a thought.

  3. #3
    Eastside Powersports Slow 91's Avatar
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    sounds like something in the starting system that doesnt have enough power/tq to turn the motor over when there is compression.

  4. #4
    Check to ensure your grounds are clean and tight.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by 8 is enough View Post
    Check to ensure your grounds are clean and tight.
    Yeah. Ran redundant ground directly to starter and bypassed relay. I'm think bendix but when I pulled old starter gear was totally clean soaked in good oil. Could the bendix be dragging.....what about the pin bearing? If it was corroded shouldn't it have loosened up a bit after turning over engine wo plugs in.

    I've tried all the obvious, and again brand new starter, battery, ground and hot with redundant ground to starter. Sbt said bendix as did bubba at rival but I just am not feeling that. I know it has to be something that I don't think it could be as I've done all,that. I'm just hoping someone has had this issue.

    Thanks everyone for input.

  6. #6
    Moderator beerdart's Avatar
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    Bendix is possible but I dont see it working under less load vs full load and be so predictable.

  7. #7
    jbombino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Water Wonder View Post
    Yeah. Ran redundant ground directly to starter and bypassed relay. I'm think bendix but when I pulled old starter gear was totally clean soaked in good oil. Could the bendix be dragging.....what about the pin bearing? If it was corroded shouldn't it have loosened up a bit after turning over engine wo plugs in.

    I've tried all the obvious, and again brand new starter, battery, ground and hot with redundant ground to starter. Sbt said bendix as did bubba at rival but I just am not feeling that. I know it has to be something that I don't think it could be as I've done all,that. I'm just hoping someone has had this issue.

    Thanks everyone for input.
    Have you try starter relay? the relay tends to act the way you have described when they start going bad.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by jbombino View Post
    Have you try starter relay? the relay tends to act the way you have described when they start going bad.
    Yes. Read above.....wanted to eliminate as many variables so I ran hot directly to starter. The relay on an 02 is a tricky bugger. The one I had was bad but its also seeled in an mini ebox. Only year to do it and its totally sealed so you can't arc relay. That's why I have direct plus even if relay was ok I would still want to bypass anyway.

    I agree about bedix be too consistent to be dragging wo plugs. I'm going to pull pump but I know all the characturaistics of bad pump or wear ring and no rubber is hanging and no bearing noise.

  9. #9
    Gone in 3.0 seconds... RXPT400's Avatar
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    Check the resistance of the battery positive wire and the resistance of the ground wire. Also make sure that the new battery is fully charge with 12.5 volts. Do a voltage drop test of the battery while cranking it shoulnt drop under 10 volts.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by RXPT400 View Post
    Check the resistance of the battery positive wire and the resistance of the ground wire. Also make sure that the new battery is fully charge with 12.5 volts. Do a voltage drop test of the battery while cranking it shoulnt drop under 10 volts.
    Did. Remember I jumped with f250 dual batteries while running. Still dragged.

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