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  1. #1

    2000 virage stopped running

    My 2000 Virage was running and it started having issues starting. Now it won't start at all. The batt was showing low voltage so i replaced. I bought a new batt and it fired up. I ran it for 10 min just to make sure the stator was charging the batt and seemed good. The ski started every time I hit the start button so I thought it was just a batt prob. The next day I went to start it before I dropped it in the water and it would not start. The batt still shows good on the meter. I did some research on here and opened the electrical box. When I looked inside the gray wire from the CDI was unhooked and taped up with electric tape. Btw I bought this ski used. The ski was def starting and running fine with the gray wire unhooked. I took the tape off and connected the gray wire to a gray and red striped wire coming from outside the electrical box. Still no start. But i didnt try long cause i didnt have the water hooked up. Why would someone disconnect that wire on purpose. Isnt it pretty imprtant. I also found another CDI in the front compartment. the previous owner told me he had the cdi replaced so I have both. Each has a different part number. The original is 4010381 and the one that is connected is 4010404. Is that the right CDI? Also the bilge pump is disconnected in the engine compartment. If I connect it, it runs constantly. Is that associated with a bad CDI. What's my next step?


  2. #2
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Welcome

    The bilge pump running all the time indicates the LR module has failed. In the Virage and Genesis, the LR module is also the Start/Stop module.

    Bypass the LR-505 module and see if it will start.

    Leave that gray wire unhooked until we get the machine starting and running properly.

  3. #3
    How do you bypass the lr-505. The bilge pump wasent working right since the day I got it. The original owner told me about it. The jetski ran fine with it unhooked so I never looked at it to much. Also will not start if you hold down the bilge pump button. Does the pump need to be hooked up I order for it that trick to work?

  4. #4
    Ok so i bypassed the the lr505 using these instrictions

    The LR-505 Start/Stop module can be bypassed for testing purposes. Do not continue to use it without a working Start/Stop module.

    Bypass LR-505 module to diagnose lanyard out crank, lanyard in no-crank condition - can also diagnose some other symptoms

    Find the LR-505 module in the electrical box.

    Disconnect all the LR-505 module wires.

    Find the non-LR Black/White wire and move it to the Black terminal.

    Note: This is just for testing, and needs to be moved back to the Black/White terminal after the test.

    Move the Red/Purple wire for the CDI to the Red/Purple terminal where all other Red/Purple wires connect.
    Edit: Alternate method is to hold the Bilge button down to supply power to the CDI through the Orange wires. Bilge pump should run with Bilge button held down, and engine should have spark when cranking.

    You have now by-passed the LR-505 Start/Stop module, and the only way to stop the engine is using the lanyard.



    The Start button will start the engine, but will not stop the engine.

    Confirm that the engine now starts. Shut it off by removing the lanyard.

    If the engine now cranks and starts as it should with the lanyard in place, and does NOT behave when the LR-505 is reconnected as it was before, then the LR-505 has failed.

  5. #5
    I still have no spark. Engine turns over just won't start. The spark plugs were removed and placed on the engine and I can't see any spark. I think I did It right. There was one black wire coming from the lr that's unhooked now. I made a female to female adaptor that goes from the b/w wire to the point where the black wire from the lr use to connect. theres also two other black wires that are hooked to it at that connection point. Also the red/purple wire went to the cdi, the circuit breaker, and to point where they all connect. I just disconnected the cdi. I don't really understand that point of the instructions. Move the r/p wire from cdi to where all the r/p wires connect. It looked like it was already hooked up that way. The r/p wire comes from outside the box to a connection that goes to the cdi and the circuit breaker then from the circuit breaker to the point where they all connect. You can unhook the cdi from that connection. Now it goes from outside to the circuit breaker to the point where they all connect with the r/p wire disconnected from the Cdi. Still no spark. Also no spark if I connect the r/p wire.
    Last edited by Spsnando; 05-29-2013 at 08:12 AM.

  6. #6
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spsnando View Post
    I still have no spark. Engine turns over just won't start. The spark plugs were removed and placed on the engine and I can't see any spark.

    I think I did It right. There was one black wire coming from the lr that's unhooked now. I made a female to female adaptor that goes from the b/w wire to the point where the black wire from the lr use to connect. theres also two other black wires that are hooked to it at that connection point.
    No adapter needed

    After unplugging all the LR module wires, they stay disconnected. That leaves only one other Black/White wire, which comes from elsewhere. That other Black/White wire gets temporarily moved from its normal Black/White terminal to one of the Black terminals.

    Also the red/purple wire went to the cdi, the circuit breaker, and to point where they all connect. I just disconnected the cdi.
    Some 2000 model year machines are wired using the 'old' factory Red/Purple wiring method, and it appears yours is one of these. In your case no changes needed to be made to the Red/Purple wiring, as the CDI was already directly connected with/to all the other Red/Purple wires. Reconnect the CDI with all the other Red/Purple wires.

    Some 2000 and all later machines have the wiring modified (or came from the factory) to comply with the Service Bulletin PWC-00-05. This change causes the CDI to be powered through the Orange wire from the LR module, hence the need to move the CDI Red/Purple wire when the LR module is disconnected (or use the Bilge button to force the Orange wire to power the CDI).

    I don't really understand that point of the instructions. Move the r/p wire from cdi to where all the r/p wires connect. It looked like it was already hooked up that way. The r/p wire comes from outside the box to a connection that goes to the cdi and the circuit breaker then from the circuit breaker to the point where they all connect. You can unhook the cdi from that connection.
    Sorry for the confusion.

    Now it goes from outside to the circuit breaker to the point where they all connect with the r/p wire disconnected from the Cdi.

    Still no spark. Also no spark if I connect the r/p wire.
    Leave the Red/Purple CDI wire connected with all the others.

    Were ALL the LR module wires disconnected?
    Last edited by K447; 05-29-2013 at 10:02 AM.

  7. #7
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    This is how it's hooked up. I used the jumper/adaptor from the only b/w wire coming from outside the box to what looks like a ground block of some sort. theres two other black wires also connected there but the black wire from the LR is disconnected as well as all the LR wires. The other b/w wires go from the cdi to the ignition coil I believe. The red/purple wires are all connected again. Still no spark.

  8. #8
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Assuming the CDI is now correctly wired and with LR bypassed, move on to diagnosing the magneto stator and the CDI.

    See my signature links for details on testing the Gen III red domestic engine ignition. Ohm check the stator coils, and test the Hall Effect sensors.

    Confirm each stator and CDI wire is connected to the correct place. Sometimes the color code markings on the terminal board can be misunderstood if adjacent to several terminal posts.

    Ohm check the ignition coils, grounds and spark plug wires.

    When the engine is cranking, do you have 8 volts on the Brown wire that connects from CDI to stator?

    Note: Garden hose water connection will not be needed, even if you get the engine to start. You can safely run these engines without water for 10-20 seconds at a time.

  9. #9
    I get 1.8 volts at crank on the brown wire coming from the cdi. What test is that? Stator. How do you rotate the flywheel for the 9volt test. Do I have to remove something. After I do the test how do I know what reading is good or bad. The instructions on how to test are not to clear to me. Theres three cylinder two cylinder old engine new engine specs all mixed together and skips back and forth. How do I know if the coil, the hull effect sensor, or the stator is bad. What numbers should i be looking for? I think I found the right instructions but I have no idea what the numbers mean or where to start. I tired searching but there is so many post. Please give me specific instructions on how to test and how to tell if something went bad cause I'm lost. What should my meter be set to when testing?Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Spsnando; 05-29-2013 at 12:55 PM.

  10. #10
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spsnando View Post
    I get 1.8 volts at crank on the brown wire coming from the cdi. What test is that? Stator
    The stator and CDI interact (obviously).

    When the engine is cranking (not yet running) the stator coils delver AC voltage to the CDI. The CDI uses this to both power the high voltage ignition circuit and to recognize that the engine is indeed rotating.

    The CDI also uses battery power from the Red/Purple wire to power the itself, but only when it thinks the engine is already rotating.

    In turn the CDI generates a special 8 volt DC power feed on the Brown wire, just for the Hall Effect sensor chips embedded inside the stator. These sensors respond to a tiny magnet located within the timing ring of the flywheel, and signal to the CDI when the piston in each cylinder is approaching Top Dead Center (TDC).

    When the engine is rotating, and the Hall Effect sensors are powered up, the CDI is ready to actually deliver spark. When the Hall Effect sensor triggers, the CDI calculates the correct delay and then fires the ignition coil for the appropriate cylinder.

    In this case (very weak voltage on Brown wire) either;
    the CDI does not think the engine is rotating,
    or the CDI does not have enough battery voltage to function,
    or the CDI is defective,
    or the stator is defective,
    or a wire is not connected somewhere.

    These red engine CDI require a really strong battery or you will not have spark. The absolute minimum voltage, at the CDI on the Red/Purple wire, while the battery is cranking the engine, must be more than 10.6 volts. You really want to see voltages closer to 11.0 volts (more is better) while cranking the engine.

    Note: On the red two cylinder engines with Gen III ignitions, there is actually only one ignition coil, which fires both spark plugs any time either cylinder needs ignition. So the ignition coil fires twice per crank revolution, with only one cylinder actually combusting fuel each time. The other cylinder gets spark, but that spark is wasted since there is no fuel ready to burn. Hence the designation of 'wasted spark' for this ignition system.

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