Thread: 2004 msx-150
07-07-2013, 01:16 PM #1
- Join Date
- Jul 2013
Hello Fellow Polaris Friends - It seems like no one enjoys Polaris anymore! I am happy I found yall!
I have a 2004 MSX-150 Turbo that I am having what I think is an over-boost problem. The ski starts and runs fine and then shortly after starting the check engine light comes on and the red light starts flashing.
If I pull the lanyard and push the reset button - I can restart the engine and take off , hear the turbo spool and then it falls back to the 4900 RPM. If I repeat the procedure it will come back to life and then go into that limp mode.
Things I have done:
1.) Replaced both MAP sensors although they appeared to be clean.
2.) Checked the waste gate - It seems to be free - I can pull it do down and it snaps back shut. Its a fluid motion - Its not easy to move but not hard - just feels like there is a spring on it.
3.) The actuator seems to be responding to the 12V from the computer - However I am not able to see the waste gate arm move - Should I be able to? The ski is new to me and I am a little confused about the ports on the actuator - currently the lines go in the left and out the right - with a port sticking straight up. Should this be vented to atmosphere?
07-07-2013, 03:06 PM #2
Hello and first of all welcome to Greenhulk !!!
According to the repair manual that limited RPM you have sounds like its an overboost issue you have.
"Engine RPM limited to 4700 Ī 200 and the
CHECK ENGINE MIL LIGHT is on.
ECU has detected an overboost condition "
You should be able to move the gastewaste arm with a little effort , I once had an issue with a sticked arm, and had to replace the exhaust manifold. do you have the old or updated wastegate solenoid ?? check my post here for the proper way to connect the updated one ... http://www.greenhulk.net/forums/show...00#post2035500
07-07-2013, 05:48 PM #3
Welcome on board, Hp38
Sounds like a boost solenoid problem, stuck open!
And causing over boost,
They are tricky to nail down as the problem, as I learnt,
This was discovered after hours of testing by my friend steelroe.
It sounds yours is happening in reverse to ours, happy hunting.
Testing the Wastegate solenoid, Weber MSX 150
Working on a MSX150 today. Problem with lack of RPM (low boost).
Checked everything over and all checked good. Removed wastegate solenoid and tested it using a 12V battery and by blowing through the ports while energising the solenoid, tested perfect. Or so we thought.
So on the water testing. I was getting a max RPM of 6800-7000. This ski is fitted with the Desperado Stage 2 so should be maxing out at approx 7700-7800
I also had my bost gauge connected and it was showing a max boost of approx 11.5-12psi
While on the water we removed the pipe from the solenoid to the wastegate actuator. And sure enough on flooring the throttle the ski boosted to max and activated the "overboost alarm".
Wastegate solenoid problem.
Retest the solenoid again only this time I tested using a compressed air through a regulator, pressure applied to the port on the solenoid that is connected to the side of the turbo housing.
While increasing the air pressure to the solenoid, I also pulsed the valve open and closed using a 12v battery, I could hear it clicking open and closed up to approx 11-12 psi and then it stopped clicking and the port no longer switched. The pressure applied by the regulator was high enough overcome the power of the solenoid.
I had a couple of spare solenoids and test them in the same way using compressed air. These solenoids continued to open ad closed up to 35psi, and then stopped clicking.
So problem only raised its head when the boost reached 11-12 psi, this pressure was enough to hold the valve open (weak solenoid valve), thus applying pressure to the actuator keeping the wastegate open.
So if you think you solenoid is OK, testing it as above will wil confirm for sure.
Simply applying 12v to open and close it does not mean it is working correctly.
Hope this helps someone in the future.
07-07-2013, 06:20 PM #4
- Join Date
- Jul 2013
Hey Isaacv & Hitch -
Thanks for the responses and the warm welcome! Its nice to find a home where people still enjoy the Polaris ski's ... Unfortunately the stealer-ships are long gone and hardly will admit they carried Polaris at one time ...
Anyway I digress!
I checked the power to the solenoid and I am seeing about 7v at idle. I did NOT go and put power to it to see if I could hear it "click" ...
I think my actuator is fine.
I do however think that the solenoid is hooked up wrong ... So let me see if I can describe this!!
So lets say that the electrical connection and left and right ports are all on a horizontal plane ... My vacuum line from the turbo to the port below the electrical connection. Then the line for the actuator is simply on the other side - NOT on the top (as if to point to the sky).
It looks like - on the picture you posted that the line to the actuator goes to the port pointing to the sky??
I was reading some other posts that say this solenoid is the same one for a Volvo? I noticed that the blow off valve is the same for an Audi TT ... !! The whole engine reminds me of an old engine out of a Morris Minor or Austin Healy!
Is there a good place to buy the upgraded actuator? Friends of the forum we should do business with?
07-07-2013, 09:28 PM #5
07-07-2013, 09:31 PM #6
- Join Date
- Jul 2007
- near Toronto, Canada
07-14-2013, 08:49 PM #7
- Join Date
- Jul 2013
Hello guys - ok I received the solenoid this weekend and got it hooked up correctly and I am still having a problem.
I can start the machine and it will takeoff and then the check engine light comes on with reduced power.. .
I can turn the machine off - pull the lanyard and then restart... And the process happens all over again.
One thing I failed to mention and I am not sure if it has anything to do with - however last summer the ski sucked up a ski rope ... We turned the ski over to remove the rope - at the time Polaris told us to turn the ski a certain way...
If my memory serves me right - the ski ran after it sucked up the rope - however I am not certain.
07-15-2013, 03:57 AM #8
Have you checked the signal hose from the turbo to the solenoid? Make sure you can blow through it, I have seen them gummed up.
07-15-2013, 07:32 AM #9
- Join Date
- Jul 2013
Hey Kosh -
I have checked that line and I can hear is blowing down in the turbo.
Now - the line going to the acuator - will hold vacuum however I don't see the waste gate moving. I can't wrap my mind around how that works so perhaps someone can guide me on how to check that.
07-15-2013, 08:37 AM #10
Your post about sucking up a ski rope and rolling the ski over flagged something to me. This is my experience that these skis HATE to be rolled over, even if you right them up the proper direction (clockwise). I know you said your MAP sensors were clean, but have you taken apart all the intake hoses to check for any signs of oil ingestion?
I am not saying this is the problem, but every time I my mother has rolled her ski, it has ingested oil and we have to clean the whole intake system out. Even after doing this and replacing MAP sensors, we still had problems with the ski running at 4800 RPM. The problem has always gotten fixed for us when we replaced the O2 sensor on the exhaust manifold just before the turbo turbine. Also when replacing this component, it has sucked because putting a new one in did not immediately fix the problem. The ski had to run for a day or two I guess to learn the signals from the new sensor? Anyways, the ski would eventually open up (first time it happened to me, I damn near had the ski jump away from under me I was so surprised) and run like it is supposed to.
When these skis are rolled over and ingest oil into the intake, not only do those MAP sensors get gummed up, but burning the oil wreaks havoc on that O2 sensor. I hope I am wrong on that as those little buggers are expensive to replace. First one we got was from a dealer for $250, then we got another one from Randy at Weberpower.com. It is also known as the lambda probe under the engine management system on his website (Item number 100030).
Wish you luck!
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