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  1. #1
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    SC Oiling Mod causing Clutch FLOAT? Its a theory...

    Here is what I'm asking, as this happened to me every time I rode last year...And its just a THEORY that I have that some of you might be seeing...

    When I rebuilt my motor I updated the oil squirter to the 08+ unit, simple to do...Ran my old Riva S3 during break in with no issues...HOWEVER, once I got near 7-8 hours I started to really stretch the motor out with longer WOT's and such...and near the end of a few of them, it felt like the SC was starting to SLIP. It would drop boost, not a lot, but just enough to make me lose 100ish rpm...which was odd, since I know I set the slip high on the S3 and did not abuse it....

    No biggie, its almost 10 hours, I'll toss my freshly rebuilt Bkit with slip set high...Swapped chargers, took ski on long river rides, would hold boost fine...Then, like clockwork, I would drop a pound and lose rpm....HMMMMMM, came to river turn around, stopped, let ski sit for 20-30 minutes...Start back up, go out, FULL BOOST, its back....Then after long run time, go to WOT....motor would hit boost, then drop....WTF???

    Get home, pull charger, check slip.....Right where I left it....Took it apart, checked clutches, NO ABNORMAL WEAR, just light stuff.....Put it back together, grab the S3, check slip...PERFECT, right where I left it....

    So winter time, got me thinking......How can the clutches be slipping, but show no signs of wear...and slip is the same. WHAT CHANGED?

    The only thing I could think of was the oiler mod...and its putting more oil in the shaft, compared to the old squirter setup...

    Thats when it hit me...As the motor got hotter, and the oil thinned out, the oil is now being forced into the shaft and out through the bearing hole...but my chargers do not have the relief mod on the back housing...so when the oil gets thin and gets high pressure, its actually causing the clutches to FLOAT on the gear, kinda like black ice on a road.......And that is why X chargers and all newer SC's from 08/09 and up have the relief in them...to relieve excess oil pressure and prevent float...HHHHMMMMMMMMM


    Just a thought....as this is an example of when the wife asks me "what are you thinking about?" and I go "you wouldn't understand..." and she says "try me...", which I start to speak...and I am then told to "just shut up..." after I mutter a sentence or 2.......


  2. #2
    boost junkie skidoochris's Avatar
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    it would be easy to prove with a boost data log
    IMO its heat soak

  3. #3
    Moderator Snoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danny View Post
    Here is what I'm asking, as this happened to me every time I rode last year...And its just a THEORY that I have that some of you might be seeing...

    When I rebuilt my motor I updated the oil squirter to the 08+ unit, simple to do...Ran my old Riva S3 during break in with no issues...HOWEVER, once I got near 7-8 hours I started to really stretch the motor out with longer WOT's and such...and near the end of a few of them, it felt like the SC was starting to SLIP. It would drop boost, not a lot, but just enough to make me lose 100ish rpm...which was odd, since I know I set the slip high on the S3 and did not abuse it....

    No biggie, its almost 10 hours, I'll toss my freshly rebuilt Bkit with slip set high...Swapped chargers, took ski on long river rides, would hold boost fine...Then, like clockwork, I would drop a pound and lose rpm....HMMMMMM, came to river turn around, stopped, let ski sit for 20-30 minutes...Start back up, go out, FULL BOOST, its back....Then after long run time, go to WOT....motor would hit boost, then drop....WTF???

    Get home, pull charger, check slip.....Right where I left it....Took it apart, checked clutches, NO ABNORMAL WEAR, just light stuff.....Put it back together, grab the S3, check slip...PERFECT, right where I left it....

    So winter time, got me thinking......How can the clutches be slipping, but show no signs of wear...and slip is the same. WHAT CHANGED?

    Your pre-load is not set right

    The only thing I could think of was the oiler mod...and its putting more oil in the shaft, compared to the old squirter setup...

    Thats when it hit me...As the motor got hotter, and the oil thinned out, the oil is now being forced into the shaft and out through the bearing hole..

    Wrong,oil does not gat forced out that releif hole,there is no way for the oil to get into the housing by means of the oiler..The oil is centrificaly slung in there,NOT squirted in by the oiler mod....but my chargers do not have the relief mod on the back housing...so when the oil gets thin and gets high pressure, its actually causing the clutches to FLOAT on the gear, kinda like black ice on a road...Good theory BUT how can oil in the housing float the clutch assembly???when the clutch assembly is outside of the housing....And that is why X chargers and all newer SC's from 08/09 and up have the relief in them...to relieve excess oil pressure and prevent float...HHHHMMMMMMMMM

    The hole in the housing is to allow excess oil to drain out of the housing,it has nothing to do with the clutches


    Just a thought....as this is an example of when the wife asks me "what are you thinking about?" and I go "you wouldn't understand..." and she says "try me...", which I start to speak...and I am then told to "just shut up..." after I mutter a sentence or 2.......
    Danny,that hole on the X chargers has nothing to do with the oiler mod as that hole is to allow the oil to drain back out of the bearings,NOT the shaft..there is no way that the oil shooting into the shaft fills the bearings/housing...NOW it will get slung from the centrifical forces as it comes out the 4 relief holes on the gear and flywheel assembly, BUT doesn not enter the housing by means of pressure from the oiler....As far as your slip goes are you pre-loading your slip??and if so what to???I havent yet done a Scer that has had an 08 oiler system were i have had people complain about this "issue"...Slip setup is key to making it work and preloading the clutches to slip at the desired rate is were its at...anybody can set a slip to 144 inch lbs BUT to know were to "preload" them is key.....Also oil type and weight comes into play here a little bit also.......As simple as a Scer clutch is to work on,it is the setup that is key to a properly working Scer....

  4. #4
    Bob 1tommygunner1927's Avatar
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    Sno....please explain "pre-loading".........cause I don't have a clue what that is.

  5. #5
    REID2168's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidoochris View Post
    it would be easy to prove with a boost data log
    IMO its heat soak

    my guess too........BINGO DINGO!!!!!!!!!!!

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  7. #6
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    2 PM's from forum members, and a personal call from Sno.....

    Heat soak, as I was running an XS IC core in the Manicooler at the time...And since i monitor my boost BEFORE the core, but after the TB, I need to torque my SC wheel more from the OEM 22 ft/lbs to around 25....As bigger chargers want a little more clamp to them...

    Thank you Sno...and PM's for the "smack" to the back of my head.....

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  9. #7
    shrabber's Avatar
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    Well here's something to ponder and something I did to provide maxium viscosity and oil pressure at optimum engine temps . I ran a seperate cooling line to oil cooler.Have you checked oil pressure at the time motor was at peek operating temp your oil cooler may not be cooling properly or your motor might not be cooling efficiently. Of course they work hand in hand to hot internal temps will not only break down in viscosity it will also decrease oil pressure.

  10. #8
    Eric Ocman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danny View Post
    2 PM's from forum members, and a personal call from Sno.....

    Heat soak, as I was running an XS IC core in the Manicooler at the time...And since i monitor my boost BEFORE the core, but after the TB, I need to torque my SC wheel more from the OEM 22 ft/lbs to around 25....As bigger chargers want a little more clamp to them...

    Thank you Sno...and PM's for the "smack" to the back of my head.....
    Talking about the gold nut or?

  11. #9
    Bob 1tommygunner1927's Avatar
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    Sno......Thank you for the detailed explanation of "preloading" the slip, and also for the other helpful info. Drive safe and we'll talk again soon!

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  13. #10
    Moderator Snoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocman View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Danny View Post
    2 PM's from forum members, and a personal call from Sno.....

    Heat soak, as I was running an XS IC core in the Manicooler at the time...And since i monitor my boost BEFORE the core, but after the TB, I need to torque my SC wheel more from the OEM 22 ft/lbs to around 25....As bigger chargers want a little more clamp to them...

    Thank you Sno...and PM's for the "smack" to the back of my head.....
    Talking about the gold nut or?
    . no Eric the fan nut...the gold clutch nut stays at 22 foot pounds

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