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  1. #1

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    '98 GTX-RFI- Do impeller shaft bearings have an orientation?

    The Sea-Doo shop manual says to press the bearing into the pump housing so the end with the P/N stamped on it is facing out. I took the pump to a dealer to have this job done because I don't have a press. Of course they installed one of the bearings with the stamped end facing in. Should I take it back and have them correct this? I don't see how this could adversely affect the function of the pump because the bearings look symmetrical. Any thoughts?


  2. #2
    This is how I run a jetski shop in the desert nmpeter's Avatar
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    uh yeah..you paid them to install the bearings..they were installed in a manner that contradicts the service manual. Unacceptable.

    While it might not make a whole bitchin amount of difference, why would BRP specify the end with the part number?

    If the bearing looked identical and nobody else chimes in about it, you might want to let it go.

    Unless of course you have plans on buying a press and a whole bunch of one time use tools.

    While they will certainly fix it if you bring it to them, the next work you need might take a few weeks to get done, if you know what I mean. For future work, have a conversation and make sure your needs are met. That is what you pay $90 an hour for.

    You'll want to triple check your facts as the manuals sometimes can change..who knows..maybe it's supposed to be the other way _now_

    Me?..Well heck..there is a sign hanging over my press that reads:

    One Way Trip to hell awarded if you screw it up
    Check it one more time
    It does NOT need one more pull
    This is really a loaded gun-Surprise!

  3. #3
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    I'm not sure why the service manual would say that? They are cylindrical not tapered. Aftermarket bearings have no part number. I've never paid any attention to orientation and never had any trouble, I'm confident it doesn't matter.

  4. #4
    This is how I run a jetski shop in the desert nmpeter's Avatar
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    ok, so I reviewed a manual and it's pretty clear on the " stamped end" business. from looking at the diagrams there "could" be some issue with lubrication passing by as the other thing they are pretty specific about is the distances. There is certainly a reason why they state the position for the bearing. The worse that can happen is a premature fail..and there is a better chance of a problem with a heavy handed or sloppy mechanic installing the bearing. I can't remember the last time I had to change out one of those..by the time I see em the entire pump is toast.

    I do have a 4 tec bearing tool..it's handy for a number of applications outside of 4-tec pumps. Think I used it on a Kawasaki once.

    in any event- for the curious the OEM bearing install tool is $125, so unless you fancy expensive single use tools, best to just pay somebody else to do it.if you eff it up and have to replace the bearings..those babies (oem) list for $18 each.

    In this case I'd slather the bearing and shaft in some high quality waterproof grease and then on top of that use synthetic pump oil. Pull the pump to inspect in 50 hours. If there is a problem, it should be noticeable by then by the silvery appearance of the pump oil if one of the bearings is starving for oil and the impeller shaft is taking a beating.

    Could be the "stamped side" has an oil groove cut in it.

    When a service manual states the ridiculous "starter removal requires engine removal ( not true there Kawasaki-san ) I question authority. When it's a bit simpler like " the shiny parts face up" I tend to do it and not look to deeply as to why. If I can do it faster I'll try to..but to ignore directions that have little or no time penalty is simply folly.

    Since getting this redone puts the OP in danger of hitting the penalty box next time he needs something at the dealer, an inspection in 50 hours may be worth the couple of hours it is going to take

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  5. #5

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    Pete-I have done some more research and these bearings are "drawn cup needle roller bearings". As you can see from this Timken TechTips:http://www.timken.com/EN-US/solution...n_Part3of3.pdf they state that the stamped end be placed against the installation tool. Upon further inspection of my old bearings I can see that the lip that encloses the bearings/cage is thicker on the stamped end. I'm theorizing that this gives added strength for the stamping and installing processes. So, while the bearing can be pressed from the opposite end, the chance of deforming it is increased. I contacted the dealer and as expected the mechanic had never heard of this. All around I think this is a cheap design since its' proper performance is so dependent on proper installation techniques.

  6. #6
    This is how I run a jetski shop in the desert nmpeter's Avatar
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    Great Find! I'll disagree however that the stamped end makes the bearing less likely to distort on install..that's all a function of the press operators hurry and prep of the bearing and housing.

    Still good to know it wasn't a Seadoo goof in the manual as this appears to be the bearing maker procedure as well.

    I'm just wondering if the lube flow holes could be blocked if the thicker end of the bearing goes in first , seeing that the clearances for installation are specific with a mm of fudge room.

    Now seeing some of the poor excuse for lubricant that I've had the displeasure of draining from a pump that hasn't been serviced in 10+ years I'd say the needle bearings bearings are pretty tough and as long as the shaft is in pristine shape and the bearings get good lube up before it's all closed up you shouldn't have too much to worry about.

    Now if your primary use for that ski was to push a shuttlecraft or other pump centric operation I'd have a little worry about it for long term.

    the 50 hour inspection will give you a very clear picture of what's happening in there.

  7. #7
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    As long as they didn't booger up the new bearing I'm sure it will be fine. You should be changing the pump oil every year anyway so as nmpeter said you will see a potential problem in the used lube. I sure wouldn't worry about it getting proper lube, the pump itself has an oil hole so the lube can easily travel through the whole center, and the design of the bearing itself has gaps between every needle. I'm not sure you COULD starve it with a proper oil level inside.

  8. #8

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    I agree-it will probably be fine and I do change the oil every year mainly because the cone traps water which will freeze and cause problems. I inspected the assembly and verified that the rolling elements are turning and that the cup was not distorted but I also discovered that the "B" dimension in the illustration Pete posted above is also out of spec. at .050". This gap allows more lube to get to this end of the bearing.

    Myself-I should have taken your advice and just bought a used pump. From a financial standpoint I'm into this pump for about $170 (wear ring, bearings/seal install) and the prices I found for used ones were more than this and in an unknown condition. I know I'm over analyzing this but I had problems before getting new bearings pressed in this pump (by a different shop and Impros) so I believe it warrants careful consideration. Plus I'm bored

  9. #9
    This is how I run a jetski shop in the desert nmpeter's Avatar
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    considering what I typically get for jetpump rebuilds, you are doing just dandy

    the only time I would buy a new pump is when the stator veins are totally shot or the bit of rock that got caught in the pump cut thru the wear ring and half of the housing.

    Buying a used pump is always a dicey proposition, not that I haven't gone that route before. I had a couple of ultra 150 a couple of years ago where the pumps were in such poor condition ( salt water refugee) where it made total sense just to buy a couple of used one ( the ulta 150 is one of those models where aftermarket pumps on the cheap hasn't happened.)

    The Chinese copies of the popular pumps are a bargain, considering pumps can't last forever in some markets (like mine)

    It's not that the Seadoo parts are overly priced, but after that and labor to assemble them, the aftermarket ones seem like a good deal for your average owner.

    New bearings and personal assembly always provide peace of mind you can't put a price tag on.

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