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  1. #1

    MSX 110 Overheat Issue?

    Hello All,

    Looking for a little input regarding a MSX 110 that I recently purchased that has me stumped. I purchased the ski in non-running condition and have gone through it and gotten to the point where it runs well, but only for around 10 or so minutes before I get a overheat indicator and the ski goes into limp mode.

    I have gone through the entire cooling system to verify that the fresh water circuit is flowing properly...checked the intake screen, verified that the exhaust jet is flowing properly, verified that the exhaust temp sensor is not creating the warning, verified that there is water exiting the rear of the ski through both the exhaust and the water outlet by the jet pump ...etc... I have checked the internal cooling circuit and verified that the water pump is flowing, the thermostat is opening, coolant level is staying the same, no oil in the coolant, and no water in the oil. I have checked all lines to make sure there are no kinks or restriction in both curcuits. The Pto cylinder compression is at 132 and front is at 136.

    The ski when running revs easily to 7600 rpm, planes and runs properly until the overheat condition happens. When the overheat happens, the engine compartment seems cool as I can easily touch the exhaust, and all other areas of the engine without getting burned. I can even put my finger into the coolant expansion tank and while it is pretty hot, I can tell it is no where close to the boiling point.

    The only fault that I can tell within the internal cooling circuit is that there is a small hairline crack on the top of the coolant expansion tank that I am sure is releasing pressure from the closed system while running.

    Does anyone know if loss of pressure in the internal cooling circuit would cause an overheat condition and if so how?

    The lake I am running the ski on is freshwater with no weeds and is 82-84 degrees right now.

    Thanks in advance for your help and input.


  2. #2
    ripcuda's Avatar
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    Welcome to GH!

    Sounds like you've done your homework on your Weber powered ski... that's refreshing.

    The coolant system will pressurize a little when up to temps... but I don't see how that would affect your situation... as long as the coolant continues to flow. I'd still get a good coolant jug though... should be fairly cheap.

    I would suspect the coolant temp sensor (between intake runners). The Polaris Team Tips document for sensor testing says:
    COOLANT TEMPERATURE SENSOR
    (Resistance @ 68_F / 20_C): 2.5kΩ ± 5%
    My first thought as I read your details... where possible broken plastic waterpump drive gear (known issue). So I'm curious as to how you 'verified the water pump is flowing'?

    And when the engine truly overheats... it's quite noticeable when you pop the seat as far as how hot stuff feels, etc. So sounds like you aren't really overheating.

    Other possibility would be the heat exchanger (under intake manifold) not working... or clogged... but with good fresh water flow... I'm doubting this too.

    Hopefully it's just a sensor... be very careful not to really overheat the engine. It doesn't take well to overheating. It's open deck aluminum block will warp cylinders (happened to my one engine)... and/or the headgasket will go (had this happen)... and/or the head will warp (had this happen too) slightly.

    Cheers!

  3. #3
    Thanks Ripcuda for the input.....Do you know if the temp sensor is a Polaris only part or is there a cross reference number for it like the map sensors?

    Regarding the water pump.....My only gauge as to the proper function of the water pump is the fact that there is a steady stream of coolant flowing into the expansion tank through the upper hose that increases in pressure as the rpm's of the engine increase. There is also flow from the thermostat housing down to the heat exchanger, and I would think that if the water pump were smoked, that I would have no or very limited movement of the coolant. The coolant pisses out at idle and squirts straight across the expansion bottle at 4000rpm which to me indicates that the water pump is doing an adequate job.

    I did seal up the expansion tank with some JB weld and had the ski out at the lake here an hour or so ago but still have the same symptoms... I can tell without a doubt that the coolant temperature is not exceeding 180-190 degrees in the expansion tank as I can dip my finger into it for 2 or 3 seconds without getting burned while the temp indicator is firing and all areas of the engine are bearable to touch for 3 or more seconds.

  4. #4
    ripcuda's Avatar
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    Don't know of a cross ref on the coolant temp sensor. Randy at WeberPower has them for sure...

    #8 in the diagram... $32
    http://www.weberpower.com/polaris-ms...-manifold.html

    It does sound like your coolant is flowing properly... and based on your details, that it's not really overheating. Hopefully it's just a bad sensor.

    If the JB Weld coolant jug isn't holding pressure... I'd get a good used one off of folks here parting out like Grovite (give him a PM) (http://www.greenhulk.net/forums/showthread.php?t=197403) or ebay.

    Cheers!

  5. #5
    Thanks Cuda....I pulled the temp sensor and tested it with my multi-meter and I am getting about 1.9k of resistance at 70 degrees. When I chill the sensor down to around 50 degrees with an ice cube, I get am reading of around 2.5k which is where it should be at at 68 degrees so it looks like the sensor is bad.

    The cross reference part number for the sensor that came out of this ski is Bosch 0280130093 and it looks to me like it is original equipment.

    On a side note, when I pulled the sensor out of the rail a small amount of trapped air gurgled up through the sensor opening which might have had some small part in the problem also. Just for anyone's reference that may be wondering about how to bleed the air out of the closed system, this seems like a quick easy way to ensure that no air is trapped behind the thermostat after you have filled the system.

    Thanks again for your help and I will let you know how it goes once I receive the new temp sensor.

  6. #6
    Okay, so I was able to source the sensor out of NAPA auto parts yesterday and installed it and took the ski out for a run.....The ski ran for a good 20 minutes (longer than before by a good 10 minutes) but the temp sensor came back on again, so I pulled the ski and brought it back home. I decided to pull the thermostat out again and give it a thorough temperature check. I tested it three times with a good cooking thermometer and it appears as though the thermostat starts to open around 187 degrees (just cracks) and does not fully open until it reaches 207 degrees.

    Does anyone know where the fully open temp should be on these? Its a 180 degree thermostat, so I am assuming that it should be fully open at 180, but I'm not sure....

  7. #7
    ripcuda's Avatar
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    All the thermostats I've tested in a pan of water with a thermometer... all have cracked open right near their rated temp... and were fully open shortly there after. I don't recall noting the full open temps.

    But if your thermometer is accurate... those temps seem too hot. I'd get a new 160deg t-stat from WeberPower. The turbo engine will benefit from running a little on the cooler side.

    Cheers!

  8. #8
    I'm going to give it a whirl today without the thermostat in place to rule that out as a cause..... Do you happen to have a link to the proper 160deg thermostat from Weber?

  9. #9
    ripcuda's Avatar
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    Yeah... that would be an easy way to test. Be sure to give it a really good warmup before flogging.

    Here's the t-stats at WeberPower: http://www.weberpower.com/parts-webe...hermostat.html

    Cheers!

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