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  1. #1
    JayZ's Avatar
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    97 GTX starting problems

    ok, posting this for a friend. here is a little bit of background history on the ski.

    this was actually my old gtx. engine rebuilt at 75 hours due to leaky exhaust/manifold gasket (ski now has just over 200 hours). at time of engine rebuild, fuel lines replaced, f/a added, carbs rebuilt and jetted. this ski would always start very easily, usually within a couple of seconds of holding the start button.

    ski was started from its winter sleep with no problems. for it's first ride, it was warmed up and idled for a while until getting out into the lake. as he gave it some gas and hit a few small waves, the ski started to die like the fuel was shut off. didn't even get up to full throttle. couldn't get the ski started and had a long paddle back to the launch.

    785xp and i had a look at it this weekend. compression check ok, new plugs, trimmed plug wires, disconnected the rectifier. still would not start. it sounds like it wants to start but it just isn't catching. the plugs are wet with fuel and there is spark. we even pulled the front cover on the engine to check the pick-up and stator. everything looks ok. didn't perform any electrical checks as we didn't know what exactly to check. visually it looked brand new in there, no broken wires.

    one thing we forgot to check was the continuity of the small black wire in the rear electrical box. although i doubt anything would be bad in there, again everything looks brand new.

    we were getting the odd blow back of fuel/smoke through the f/a. my thinking is that is just from trying to start it so much with the choke closed and throttle open. we did manage to get it started one time for about 5 seconds. it was running really rough/missing badly.

    any ideas? i think i have a spare coil to send him, but not sure if that will fix things. my gut tells me that it has weak spark. any way to check the strength of the spark on these machines?

    thanks

    j


  2. #2
    Tool Bag water worx's Avatar
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    Spark is spark.

    If I had a dollar for every time I have heard that one.

    Compression,rotary valve timing ??

    My guess it it probally flooded due to your buddy trying to start it on the water probally using the choke to much ???

  3. #3
    JayZ's Avatar
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    the reason i bring up weak spark, is that this is one of the items listed in the sea-doo shop manual.

    compression is good. already mentioned that. pto cylinder was 5psi lower than the mag. didn't physically check rotary valve timing, but since it was running, then stalled, i'll guess that it is still ok. if i get a chance to take the carbs off, i'll check it just to be sure. can the rotary valve gear go bad and the engine still have good compression?

    i really don't think that the ski is flooded. i tried starting the ski myself with no choke or throttle. same results. also, how do you explain the ski running fine for several minutes, get up to 1/2-3/4 throttle, then stalling? flooded? not likely in my view.

  4. #4

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    maybe the fuel selector is screwed up, try just bypassing that, as the access to the fuel tank and fuel bowl is easy. Also take a look down the raves check for any damage.

    TLR

  5. #5
    Tool Bag water worx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayZ View Post
    the reason i bring up weak spark, is that this is one of the items listed in the sea-doo shop manual.

    compression is good. already mentioned that. pto cylinder was 5psi lower than the mag. didn't physically check rotary valve timing, but since it was running, then stalled, i'll guess that it is still ok. if i get a chance to take the carbs off, i'll check it just to be sure. can the rotary valve gear go bad and the engine still have good compression?

    i really don't think that the ski is flooded. i tried starting the ski myself with no choke or throttle. same results. also, how do you explain the ski running fine for several minutes, get up to 1/2-3/4 throttle, then stalling? flooded? not likely in my view.
    To get a flooded ski started,you shut the fuel off & hold the throttle wide open,this allows a LOT of air to come in & lean down excess fuel in the motor.

    You stated "the plugs are wet" so that tells me it is probally flooded.

    It got flooded when your friend was on the water trying to restart it using the choke (most likley).

    On a fuel flooded motor,I open the gap on the plugs a little more than normal so excess fuel doesnt bridge the gap,turn plugs in about half way the crank for about 10 seconds,sometimes they "try" & start,remove plugs & clean with carb cleaner,blow air in plug holes & retry,it takes a while but I bet it is flooded.

  6. #6
    JayZ's Avatar
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    ok, i'll pass the information on to him.

    so can a ski stay flooded for a week? if i accidentally flood an engine i can usually get it started in a few minutes. not the case this time though.

  7. #7
    96XPSS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayZ View Post
    ok, i'll pass the information on to him.

    so can a ski stay flooded for a week? if i accidentally flood an engine i can usually get it started in a few minutes. not the case this time though.
    It's possible Jay. He may also have a needle and seat sticking open, which caused this problem from the first ride. Does he have fresh gas in the ski? Did he run the carbs dry last year when he put it up for winter?

  8. #8
    785xp's Avatar
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    JayZ installed the needles and seats a couple of years ago. He had it running for quite a while before it quit, letting it get warmed up. The carbs weren't run dry, but he did have fuel stablizer.

    We also put new plugs in it. It was running by itself for about 5 seconds at WOT, but very rough.

    Robert, we just put one of those Deka batteries in it. It lasted 4 times longer than a regular battery would have while we were trying to get it started.

    Is there any way the timing could have got changed or messed up?

    He broke down on Thursday and we were trying to get it started on Saturday. Would the fuel have still been in there to flood it?

    We tried the fuel selector switch on reserve as well as the on position.

  9. #9

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    what plugs does it have?

    BR8ES is correct

    some try to run the non resistor plugs and it messes up.

    T

  10. #10
    JayZ's Avatar
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    it had the correct plugs in it. we also tried a brand new set.

    mike, i emailed dan and told him to 'unflood' the ski as water worx described. i also told him to meter out the small black wire from the rear elec. box before switching coils. not sure if he has a multimeter, so you may have to go and check it for him.
    Last edited by JayZ; 04-21-2008 at 10:18 PM.

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