Thread: Anyone use MAG 1 2 stroke oil
12-15-2008, 12:59 PM #1
- Join Date
- Oct 2008
Anyone use MAG 1 2 stroke oil
wondering if anyone has any comments about Mag 1 2 stroke oil? it is a tCW3 oil that also says for use in API TC applications. It is only $9 a gallon so I am a little worried about using it. ANy ideas or feedback on this oil for use in a seadoo 800 motor
12-15-2008, 03:39 PM #2
12-15-2008, 04:38 PM #3
- Join Date
- Oct 2008
12-15-2008, 09:09 PM #4
never used it, it is minimum rating since your sheet claims JASO FB Specifications. SD wants you to use synthetic or a blend.
your ski, if you want to be cheap go ahead. the best cheap oil i know of is the quicksilver synthetic at wally-world and a local lake boat with 787 that runs it the raves stay clean for the hours and flooding that happens to it.
i still use maxima - just what i've always bought. no one has ever offered any good reason to switch.
plenty of oil rants in threads on these forums. i would look for something that met ISO EGC (or D) or JASO FC or D specs if i were you. brand identity is just something a marketing rep lures you in with - go for spec and price
12-15-2008, 09:55 PM #5
- Join Date
- Oct 2008
no, i don't want to cheap out. Is the JASO FB Specifications better or worse than the API TC. What spec shoudl I be looking for?
12-15-2008, 11:35 PM #6
i'm gonna duck out of this before it gets crammed with tons of opinions. lots of info in threads already posted. here is some stuff i've saved in my pwc/doc file. there is a chart, but TC really belongs in the good column.
The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act:It is illegal for any manufacturer to require the exclusive use in the United States of their private label oil to keep their warranty valid. If a manufacturer indicates only their private label brand will satisfy warranty requirements, they are required to do one of two things. Obtain written approval from the Federal Trade Commission that no other product except their private label brand will work (currently no manufacturer has done so) or they must make the oil available to you at no cost.
TWO STROKE -Four major components make up modern two stroke oil.
- BASE STOCK - a mineral or a synthetic base is used. Represents up to 80% of finished oil
- BRIGHT STOCK/PIB Added to improve lubricity at high temps. Air-cooled engines require more bright stock due to higher cylinder temps. It is used as a component of base stock to prevent scuffing and offer additional protection. Many modern oils use polyisobutane or PIB. Typically PIB is lower smoke and cleaner burning then bright stock. Represents up to 20% of finished oil.
- SOLVENTS / DILUENTS petroleum based solvents (Stoddard, white spirits) is added to improve the blending of the oil with gas. It also reduces the viscosity (friction) of oil to let it flow through injector systems at low outside temps. Represents up to 40% of finished oil.
- DETERGENTS / ADDITIVES - Clean combustion deposits, provide corrosion protection, reduce ring sticking, power valve hang ups and plug fouling due to increased lubricity. There are two basic groups of additive packages: metal based and ash less. Represents up to 20% of finished oil.
Specifications for 2 strokes
NMMA TC-W3 two cycle water-cooled, third generation. TC-W3 obsoletes TC-W & TC-WII. Oils with this spec typically do not use metal based additives, and are ashless. This is an outboard specific spec.
API TC only API spec established for two cycle engines. It regulates lubricity, detergency, ash content & pre-ignition. Oils with this spec are typically using metal based, ash producing additives.
JASO FA original spec established regulating lubricity, detergency, initial torque, exhaust smoke, and exhaust system blocking. Now obsolete.
JASO FB increased lubricity requirements over FA.
JASO FC lubricity and initial torque requirements same as FB, however far higher detergency, exhaust smoke and exhaust system blocking requirements over FB.
JASO FD - same as FC with far higher detergency requirement.
ISO-L-EGB same tests and requirements as JASO FB.
ISO-L-EGC same tests and slightly higher detergency requirements (piston varnish) as JASO FC.
ISO-L-EGD same tests and requirements as JASO FD
- National Marine Manufacturers Association (NMMA) is based in the USA.
- American Petroleum Institute (API) is based in the USA.
- Japanese Automobile Standards Organization (JASO) is based in Japan.
- International Standards Organization (ISO) is based in Europe.
Five primary functions of oil?
Five Different groups of base stocks
- Lubricity oil reduces friction and wear by serving as a layer of protection between moving parts.
- Dispersant good oil will hold damaging particles like dirt, metal, carbon, sludge and varnish and suspend them in the oil itself, so they can be removed by the oil filter. Other wise those particles would settle to the bottom of the engine and be recirculated through the engine.
- Coolant even in liquid cooled engines oil dissipates heat away from hot spots inside the engine that coolant passages do not reach. Motorcycle clutches and transmissions rely on oil to regulate temperatures.
- Protection prevents the internal metals from damage due to oxidation and corrosion.
- Detergent Clean engine internals. Prevent rings from sticking in the piston lands and deposits from forming on the valves
Group I Solvent frozen mineral oil- least processed and lowest cost.
Group II Hydro processed & refined mineral oil- most common of petroleum based oils.
Group III Hydro-isomerized Synthetics- starts as group 1 petroleum based, then processed to remove impurities and hydrocarbon polymers. Improving the thermal and oxidative stability (high VI) over group 1 or 2. Lowest cost synthetic.
Group IV PAO (polyalphaolefin) - produced by breaking down petroleum-based oil and reforming the molecules into polymers in a planned manner. They have lower pour points (thinner), greater thermal stability (work better under high heat), and greater resistance to thermal oxidation then group 1, 2 & 3.
Group V Esters- produced by reacting an alcohol with an animal or plant based fatty acid into structured polymers (esters, diesters). Superior film strength. Esters are polar and actually cling to metal (crank, cams, rods). They act as a solvent inside the motor, causing cleaner operation. They are the most expensive to produce.
03-06-2009, 08:01 AM #7
- Join Date
- Mar 2009
torco oil is way to go
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