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  1. #1

    Genesis not charging and no reverse. Help

    Hi eveyone, first time on here since my genesis has been good to me tell now. my ski isnt charging the battery. the volts keep dropping. last year it would intermitently drop off, show low battery, guages would all go to zero, then a second later everything would all come back to normal. Also, the electric reverse wont work. nothing happens. shows no power to the electric motor other than a constant power. last year i never had any problems with this. any help would be greatly appreciated.


  2. #2
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Welcome to the Hulk

    Click here for the Service manuals.

    Is your Genesis carburetor or fuel injected?

    What model year?

    Have a look through the electrical diagnostics in the Service manual.

    What checks have you done so far?

  3. #3
    ph2ocraft's Avatar
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    I'd also like to say WELCOME to the boards mudd!!
    What voltage do you have charging to the battery, via a volt meter (not the dash unit)?

  4. #4
    it is a 2001 with direct injection. 1200. i dont have a service manual. would be a good idea to get one. i have 11.1 on the battery when it is running or not. the more it runs seems to drop. dropped to 10.6 then it wont start. last year intermitently it would drop the display. everything would go to zero, say low battery then it would all come back in a matter of a few seconds and everything is good. took the battery out for the winter and put it back in and now i have these problems. reverse???? i have no idea why it dosent work. dosent seem to have power going to it. is there fuses?

  5. #5
    Click avatar for tech links/info, donation request K447's Avatar
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    Arrow 2001 Genesis FFI (fuel injected Ficht) not charging battery, no PERC reverse

    Quote Originally Posted by K447 View Post
    ...Click here for the Service manuals.

    Have a look through the electrical diagnostics in the Service manual...
    Quote Originally Posted by muddmadness View Post
    it is a 2001 with direct injection. 1200.

    I don't have a service manual. would be a good idea to get one.
    See link above

    i have 11.1 on the battery when it is running or not. the more it runs seems to drop. dropped to 10.6 then it wont start.

    last year intermittently it would drop the display. everything would go to zero, say low battery then it would all come back in a matter of a few seconds and everything is good.

    took the battery out for the winter and put it back in and now i have these problems.

    reverse???? i have no idea why it doesn't work.
    doesn't seem to have power going to it. is there fuses?
    You may have several separate electrical problems.

    It seems to start OK for you (since you did not mention hard starting) so I will assume the battery connections, and the battery, are in reasonable shape.

    The battery charging on a fuel injected engine is controlled by the stator coils inside the flywheel, and the central EMM module. There are also some electrical connections between things.

    It seems that the EMM, while it does control and regulate the battery charging voltage, does not actually monitor the battery voltage. Only the MFI display watches the battery voltage.

    When doing any voltage tests, always use a multi-meter. Do not rely on the MFI for voltage diagnostics.

    When your battery is fully charged on a charger, and let sit overnight, what voltage does it have?
    A healthy battery should be right around 12.5 volts, after sitting (resting).

    Disconnect the battery, and open the electrical box. There should be zero moisture inside, and no corrosion on the terminal board or wire connections.

    Also check that the fuse holders are good. Only replace the fuses with new ones of the correct Amp rating, not a higher rating.

    Does the reverse work when the bilge button is held down?
    There are circuit breakers (Reset button) on the electrical box, but I think one is fuel pump, and the other is general power. If either was tripped, I do not think the engine would run.

    There is a diagnostic for the PERC reverse in the service manual.

    There is a 3 Amp fuse for the bilge pump, and another use for the MFI display.

    Assuming you have not yet found the problem;
    Unplug the 12 pin connector at the EMM, and check for moisture or corrosion on the pins. Check the stator coils using the ohm table in the manual.

    These are very low ohm values, so check carefully. 0.1 to 0.3 ohms per coil for the two battery charging coils, and 0.3 to 0.5 ohms for the three higher voltage injector power coils.

    Short your meter probes together, and make note of the fractional ohm value displayed. Your meter is reading low ohms inaccurately by that amount.

    Now subtract that number from all other ohm measurements you make with the meter, to get an accurate measurement. If your meter shows 0.4 when the probes are shorted, then subtract 0.4 from all other low ohm measurements you make.

    Now confirm that there is very high resistance (very high ohms) between each of the stator coils and the motor ground.

    Remove the spark plugs to make cranking easier on the battery and starter motor. Switch the meter to AC volts, and check the voltage from each stator coil while cranking the engine. Per the manual, voltages should be 7volts AC, and 5volts AC.

    Sometimes, I have found that spraying electrical contact cleaner into each of the contact holes on the connectors, and onto the EMM pins, has cleaned a dirty electrical contact, and solved the problem.

    Clean both the 8 and 12 pin EMM connectors. The big 40-pin EMM connector is not involved in battery charging, as far as I know, so it can be left alone.

    Let us know what the results are, and we can go from there.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by K447 View Post
    You may have several separate electrical problems.

    It seems to start OK for you (since you did not mention hard starting) so I will assume the battery connections, and the battery, are in reasonable shape.

    It starts great when the battery is topped up or i have a boost pack on it. battery connections are perfect no sign of any corrosion.

    The battery charging on a fuel injected engine is controlled by the stator coils inside the flywheel, and the central EMM module. There are also some electrical connections between things.

    It seems that the EMM, while it does control and regulate the battery charging voltage, does not actually monitor the battery voltage. Only the MFI display watches the battery voltage.

    When doing any voltage tests, always use a multi-meter. Do not rely on the MFI for voltage diagnostics.

    When your battery is fully charged on a charger, and let sit overnight, what voltage does it have?
    A healthy battery should be right around 12.5 volts, after sitting (resting).

    Disconnect the battery, and open the electrical box. There should be zero moisture inside, and no corrosion on the terminal board or wire connections.

    Also check that the fuse holders are good. Only replace the fuses with new ones of the correct Amp rating, not a higher rating.

    where are the fuses located?

    Does the reverse work when the bilge button is held down?
    There are circuit breakers (Reset button) on the electrical box, but I think one is fuel pump, and the other is general power. If either was tripped, I do not think the engine would run.

    no it wont work with the bilge button pressed. none of the breakers have been tripped. but the pump does work.

    There is a diagnostic for the PERC reverse in the service manual.

    There is a 3 Amp fuse for the bilge pump, and another use for the MFI display.

    would the reverse be on the same fuse as the bilge pump?. do you think it is just the display that was giving me the intermittent display issues last year.?

    Assuming you have not yet found the problem;
    Unplug the 12 pin connector at the EMM, and check for moisture or corrosion on the pins. Check the stator coils using the ohm table in the manual.

    i checked these connections and they appear to be in good shape. this ski is mint and the engine compartment looks like new. no corrosion anywhere.

    These are very low ohm values, so check carefully. 0.1 to 0.3 ohms per coil for the two battery charging coils, and 0.3 to 0.5 ohms for the three higher voltage injector power coils.

    Short your meter probes together, and make note of the fractional ohm value displayed. Your meter is reading low ohms inaccurately by that amount.

    Now subtract that number from all other ohm measurements you make with the meter, to get an accurate measurement. If your meter shows 0.4 when the probes are shorted, then subtract 0.4 from all other low ohm measurements you make.

    Now confirm that there is very high resistance (very high ohms) between each of the stator coils and the motor ground.

    Remove the spark plugs to make cranking easier on the battery and starter motor. Switch the meter to AC volts, and check the voltage from each stator coil while cranking the engine. Per the manual, voltages should be 7volts AC, and 5volts AC.

    this is my next plan of attack but wont get to it for a few days.

    Sometimes, I have found that spraying electrical contact cleaner into each of the contact holes on the connectors, and onto the EMM pins, has cleaned a dirty electrical contact, and solved the problem.

    Clean both the 8 and 12 pin EMM connectors. The big 40-pin EMM connector is not involved in battery charging, as far as I know, so it can be left alone.

    Let us know what the results are, and we can go from there.
    thanks a lot for the help. ill let you know how it goes and i will get on that manual.

  7. #7
    i never got a chance to look at my genesis. so i took it to the local guy with the info i recieved on here. he can't figure it out. he said he can't diagnose the computer?????? so i figure i will give it a shot now that i have a bit of time. i still havent aquired a service manual. i see some advertised on line to download. has anyone done this or can point me in the right direction.
    thanks

  8. #8
    ryandi2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muddmadness View Post
    i never got a chance to look at my genesis. so i took it to the local guy with the info i recieved on here. he can't figure it out. he said he can't diagnose the computer?????? so i figure i will give it a shot now that i have a bit of time. i still havent aquired a service manual. i see some advertised on line to download. has anyone done this or can point me in the right direction.
    thanks
    search john zigler hes a member hear that owns rcjs, hes a great guy search his name, click on his web site link, go to polaris engine i think they are at the end of the page

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